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[Sleepy123]

I'm fairly new to the HRT thing!
For the last couple of weeks I was taking 2gm sandrena gel as prescribed by a menopause specialist. I couldn't sleep so reduced it to 1.5mg, then 1mg.

During the day I felt much better but am still tossing and turning all night!

Today I'm feeling a bit sick and thinking of reducing the gel to 0.5mg, but is it still worth using such a small amount?

Or maybe I should try a different gel?

[Ladybt28]

Hello and welcome Sleepy...nice to have you aboard.
Unfortunately the effects of hrt (any hrt) are not that quick I am afraid.  Normally when you take a "medication" the effects occur within a week or so, but with hrt you are replacing hormones or balancing hormones which have been removed from your body and so it takes quite a long time to get the balance back or levels back to what they should be for your own body.
GP's and specialist meno consultants say that it is a minimum of 3 months before things should "come right", but lot of us ladies on here know that it can be longer than that and also it can take the 3 months before your realise that it is "not the right system of hrt for you"! and then you have to change it and start all over again.

The symptoms that tend to come under control most quickly are flushes, and some aches and pains but the hardest ones are usually anxiety, low mood, palpitations etc. The tossing, turning and poor sleep thing (in my experience) is a mid term thing around about 6 weeks. 

The key thing is that during your first 3 months you shouldn't mess around with your prescribed doses hardly at all.  Dropping them will not resolve the issues.  It really takes that long for the body to adjust and you may get some symptoms you didn't have before you were on the gel.  My own symptoms were horrendous and it took 6 months for me to get them under control.
You're post says a "couple of weeks" on Sandrena...I have to tell you that is the blink of an eye in hrt world!  You need to keep going on the dose you were prescribed for at least 6 weeks to see what happens before you could have any useful assessment of how it is going....it's a pain I know but this hrt thing requires oodles of patience.  Let us know how you get on.
I'm sure one of other ladies will be along in a minute  x

[Sleepy123]

Ladybt28 Thank you for taking the time to reply.

This journey sounds like a nightmare!

I have had a really stressful time in work, so started exercising to combat the stress! Yesterday I took ibuprofen for a muscle strain, so now I'm wondering if it was that ?!

Why do all these issues come at once! 

I think I will stick with the 1mg and just see if my sleep improves x

[Ladybt28]

I have been on hrt for nearly 2 years now sleepy, I use oestrogel, utrogestan on a cycle and testosterone.  It took 7 months for me to feel "well" and out of all my symptoms I would say that the sleep is still not right but bearing in mind I was averaging about 3 hours a night to start with I can now get to sleep.  It's still disturbed and made worse by stress and the odd night is really bad but by and large it's ok.  My sleep has always been poor so it's probably more to do with me than the hrt. 

[sheila99]

Did you have insomnia before you took HRT or did it only develop afterwards? If it's a meno symptom it's too soon to tell if it's working, it was 3 months before my anxiety and insomnia improved.

[Erika28]

Estradiol will help with sleep but it takes a few weeks. I would stick with 2 mg and be a little patient. Reducing the dose might actually make things worse. Insomnia is actually believed to result, at around menopause and perimenopause, from the drop in estrogen and is one of the first things to improve after beginning estrogen treatment but it takes a little time.

[Sleepy123]

Thank you everyone for all your replies 

It's difficult because I have always slept quite well (sometimes up to 10 hours) but I always felt tired. If I work an early Shift I literally felt like I had a hangover, due to only having about 3 or 4 hours sleep.

I haven't had a period for a year so I suspected it was down to the menopause and lack of estrogen?

I recently had a really stressful/shitty time at work which I thought was caused by work, but I think it was partly being exhausted by menopause. That was when I decided it was time to see a meno expert! He said my sleep would feel more ‘refreshed' but at the moment I'm just tossing and turning all night!

In the day I generally feel better and mentally stronger, but this sleep pattern is just getting me down! I guess I will have to persevere for a few weeks and see what happens?

The meno dr suggested Mirena coil but I'm waiting to see what reaction I get from the sandrena gel first. I'm thinking the patches might be more convenient but I know they are difficult to source? 

[Ladybt28]

Aside from the hrt - when I have trouble sleeping or keep waking up I use Melatonin tablets from the internet.  Melatonin is the natural chemical in the body which puts you to sleep reacting with light.  When I had insomnia I tried everything but the sleeping tablets you get from the doctor (who don't like prescribing them anyway) or the ones you can get over the counter in Boots gave me a "hung over" feeling when I did eventually wake and I had trouble waking so I sent the "natural route".

I use Melatonin tablets and/or Valarian root either in drops (Dormesan drops) or tablets.  You can get the Melatonin in 1mg/2mg/3mg/5mg or 10mg.  I only ever buy the 1mg or the 5mg so I can vary the dose dependant in how I feel.  They both work a treat and the Valarian drops are good for mild anxiety also during the day on a low dose (lower than when you take them for sleep) and don't knock you out but just take the edge off.
Wouldn't be without either and when I was at my worst they were an absolute godsend!

[Sammiejane]

hi ladies

i'm hoping u can advise

i'm unsure whether to take estrogen and progesterone together on continuous even though i don't have a uterus or take estrogen and testosterone i've been on the gel 2 pumps for a year but been having hairloss issues well shedding and feel like i'm imbalanced but worried about side effects of progesterone and testosterone , but estrogen alone has also caused a lot of weight gain that i can't shift i don't know what to do or shall i take all 3

[Erika28]

hi ladies

i'm hoping u can advise

i'm unsure whether to take estrogen and progesterone together on continuous even though i don't have a uterus or take estrogen and testosterone i've been on the gel 2 pumps for a year but been having hairloss issues well shedding and feel like i'm imbalanced but worried about side effects of progesterone and testosterone , but estrogen alone has also caused a lot of weight gain that i can't shift i don't know what to do or shall i take all 3

I suspect your hairloss is due to too low oestrogen as many women are underdosed based on my calculations (see my previous post). Ask your doctor if oestrogen can be increased. I wouldn't personally add progesterone if you don't have a uterus.

[Sleepy123]

Ladybt28 ooooh that's interesting about the melatonin tablets, I might have to give them a try!
I know what you mean about the ‘sleep hangover' from OTC tablets. I have days when I have considered taking them to help me sleep but get worried about mixing them with the HRT.

@sammiejane sorry I can't help as this is all still fairly new to me!  but I hope you get it sorted x

[Ladybt28]

Its not the mixing OTC with HRT Sleepy, it's that they have that effect generally.  It's the drug that's in them that does it, but you wouldn't get that with Melatonin unless you took higher doses which are not necessary.  The Dormesan Valarian drops you can get from any good health food shop. You have to get melatonin from the internet, it is not licensed for shops, I don't know why.
I got to Biovia, or a couple of the American site, egrocer or iherb.  I think they sell them through Amazon too but I use my usual suppliers each time depending on what offers they have on.