Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Jackanory]

Hi!

I am a 48 year old perimenopausal person. My main symptoms which bother me most are the vaginal/urinary problems and the heavy periods. I had the Novasure procedure 3 years ago which unfortunately for me didn't make much difference. I didn't fancy a hysterectomy so am just getting on with it. I have been to my local surgery numerous times over the last few years complaining of my dry old ladies vagina, which cannot cope with sex any more, and has a tendency to thrush/BV/itchiness and soreness. The GPs at my surgery will not give me any hormonal medication. They say I do not need it. I also have fibroids. My mum had oestrogen dependent breast cancer a couple of years ago, but she's fine now. My mum did take HRT, she has also been overweight her whole life and a heavy smoker.

I am trying to cope with my perimenopausal symptoms now with natural remedies. I take a large dose of Evening Primrose and Flaxseed each day. I have also spent a fortune on Seabuckthorn capsules, but I cannot afford to keep on with these, they are far too expensive and I'm not sure they make any difference. I may try red clover, but don't know if it will make the fibroids worse, or whether it increases the risk of breast cancer. As I mentioned on another thread, I am waiting for DHEA capsules to arrive and will then start making my own DHEA vaginal suppositories to hopefully help with the vaginal atrophy.

[jessieblue]

Hello Jackanory, I am also new to the forum so will be bugger all help to you probably! Lol.  I am here with similar problems actually.  Soreness redness itchiness, not sure if thrush or not...... bladder problems and i did have the heavy bleeding too but have a mirena coil which stopped that completely. Very frustrated with my body not feeling like my body anymore. So I cannot offer much advice as I am hoping to get some help here too but I feel your pain and sympathise with you very much.  Can I ask what the DHEA suppositories are please?  I have been given ovestin cream which I was hoping for a miracle with but I am not sure if its causing my sore and red bits or causing me to have thrush......I dont know whether to continue or not.  Always looking for a more natural cure for things as I always tend to have side effects to everything!

Hope you get some good advice and can soon start feeling better.  This time of life is no fun.  No fun at all! xx

[Dancinggirl]

Jackanory - welcome to MM
Are you UK based? What are your periods like?
I have responded to you on the other thread but here is the section from the NICE guidelines that you need to show your GP:
Altered sexual function
1.4.8
Consider testosterone[1] supplementation for menopausal women with low sexual desire if HRT alone is not effective.
Urogenital atrophy
1.4.9
Offer vaginal oestrogen to women with urogenital atrophy (including those on systemic HRT) and continue treatment for as long as needed to relieve symptoms.
1.4.10
Consider vaginal oestrogen for women with urogenital atrophy in whom systemic HRT is contraindicated, after seeking advice from a healthcare professional with expertise in menopause.
1.4.11
If vaginal oestrogen does not relieve symptoms of urogenital atrophy, consider increasing the dose after seeking advice from a healthcare professional with expertise in menopause.
1.4.12
Explain to women with urogenital atrophy that:
symptoms often come back when treatment is stopped
adverse effects from vaginal oestrogen are very rare
they should report unscheduled vaginal bleeding to their GP.
1.4.13
Advise women with vaginal dryness that moisturisers and lubricants can be used alone or in addition to vaginal oestrogen.
1.4.14
Do not offer routine monitoring of endometrial thickness during treatment for urogenital atrophy.


You shouldn't be having to spend all this money to try to sort your problems when a simple prescription of Vagifem would work wonders. Your GPs are being negligent I'm afraid.  Do try some SYLK moisturiser as well alongside the Vagifem.
I find Multi Gyn Actigel (buy it online) really good to treat and prevent BV and thrush - I use it a couple of times a week as prevention and then if anything flares up I use it twice a day.

BE careful of the DHEA - do look up the side effects.

If you have problems with fibroids and bleeding, have they not offered you a Mirena? This will often sort all these issues. Don't worry about breast cancer unless you have close family members who have had BC.  If you had a Mirena you would then be able to have some systemic oestrogen that might well help generally with everything.
Like you, I spent a fortune on so called ‘natural' or ‘alternative' remedies with no real success - I should have had a good holiday instead. 
Get back to your GP and ask to be referred to a specialist gynae or menopause clinic if they won't give you what you need. You are too young to be suffering in this way.

jessieblue - I found Ovestin made me sore - Vagifem is less irritating.  It does take at least 2-3 months for any local oestrogen to really work it's magic, so one has to put up with some discomfort at first. I would also try some SYLK to moisturise and sooth but not at the same time as Ovestin.

Good luck to you both  - keep us posted.  DG x

[Jackanory]

Thanks ladies for the responses.

It was my mum who had oestrogen dependent breast cancer aged 70. She is the only one in the family who has had breast cancer.

I did have the Mirena years ago for birth control but bled every day for 6 months, a lot of the time really heavily, so had it removed. I was offered it again, but because it was such a nightmare before I don't want to have it again. I know it's maybe just wishful thinking, but I really do think my periods wont go on for much longer, it's just a feeling I have, they are getting slightly longer apart and don't go on for as long, so I am hoping to get away with not having to do anything about the heavy periods.

Jessieblue, here are some of the sites where I have seen about DHEA suppositories ...

http://www.hystersisters.com/vb2/showthread.php?p=4539681

http://www.webmd.com/women/news/20160105/suppository-eases-vaginal-dryness-in-small-study

http://ths.gardenweb.com/discussions/2451751/severe-vaginal-atrophy - if you scroll down to Cube1067 she describes what she has done.

Dancinggirl, thanks for the recommendation for MultiGyn, I will buy some of this.

Thanks again ladies for your advice and support xx

[jessieblue]

Thank you both for your helpful replies.  How comes a doctor has never told me about any of these products?  It is pretty scary.  I am also UK based are you too Jackanory?  Thank you for those links I will go and have a look.

Dancinggirl is it ok to use multigyn for my soreness?  Is it a hormone too?  Im not sure if the ovestin has caused my soreness, but I did get the same soreness after a few applications of the estradiol cream which was 0 01% then I left it for a week to settle which it did and started the ovestin.  No soreness for about 10 days of using it every three days.  I didnt notice this soreness until a couple of days after last application tho.  Or is it a cumulitive effect?  If I know its the cream I would be less worried and prepared to put up with discomfort but Im worried its thrush and needs treating but scared to treat if its not and make myself more sore........and so on. Urgh......xx

[Jackanory]

Yes I am in Scotland Jessieblue. If you give Yes water based lubricant or moisturiser a go for the soreness it will help, it has aloe vera in it which soothes and repairs. I get mine from Amazon. I get pretty much everything from Amazon because I have got Amazon Prime so have next day delivery.



I think maybe the Vagifem suppositories would be less irritating than the cream for you, perhaps your GP would prescribe this for you as you are having a reaction to the cream.

I have looked at the ingredients of Ovestin and here they are ...
•The other ingredients are chlorhexidine dihydrochloride, octyldodecanol, cetyl palmitate, glycerin, cetyl alcohol, stearyl alcohol, polysorbate 60, sorbitan stearate, lactic acid, sodium hydroxide and purified water.

Lots of chemicals, and the glycerine can cause thrush, I know it does with me.

[jessieblue]

Oh good lord!!  There is so much in there apart from the hormone!  What a nightmare.  How would you treat your thrush jackanory?  I have some multigyn actigel.  I bought some last time i was sore but never used it.  I could try that while i wait for the Yes to come or is it a similar thing?  Gosh this is so confusing........and Im really sorry this is YOUR thread!

Thank yoou for being so kind as to help me.....I have just had a sudden sense of calm come over me having some people who understand to talk to.  Cannot thank you both enough. xx

 

[Jackanory]

I think prevention is better than cure Jessieblue, so if you can try to avoid upsetting the natural environment of the vagina then that's the best thing. When I do have thrush I attack it from all angles at once, so I use Caneston with hydrocortisone, plus a Canesten vaginal pessary, and I take a Diflucan tablet, all of these things you can get off Amazon, then once it's been treated just keep the vagina moisturised with the natural products and being very careful when cleaning to not get any chemicals near that area, use the Faith in Nature natural wash and rinse very thoroughly.

You just have to treat your vagina like a very fragile delicate pet 

[jessieblue]

Thank you Jackanory.  Mine certainly is fragile but im not loving it in the way I would my pets!  It has become my enemy!  I see you have urinary issues too.  What sort of symptoms do you get?  This is my biggest problem I think.  The irritation and spasm like feelings in the urethra.  Do you get utis or just irritation?

[Jackanory]

Before I realised what the problem was Jessieblue I had constant UTIs, was on antibiotics probably monthly, this went on for a  couple of years. Eventually one GP told me I should just be using water to wash my lady bits. That's when I realised I was actually aggravating the problem myself. I actually thought I was dirty so was rinsing myself with dilute tea tree to kill off bacteria. I finally realised I was upsetting the natural balance. I haven't had a UTI that has needed antibiotics since I stopped the overwashing apart from once about a month ago, and that was after I had treated myself to a bubble bath with some luxurious Elemis bath stuff that my husband had bought me for Christmas. I still do have the need to go to the loo a ridiculous amount of times though, I would describe it as a sort of overactive/sensitive bladder, I can't hold much urine without having to empty my bladder, and I am up through the night needing to go to the loo. I have however recently started taking probiotic tablets and I think this has slightly reduced the irritation. It's only been a few days so I will see how it goes. Again it was another expensive thing, £23 for the bottle of probiotics.

[jessieblue]

Oh wow Im sorry to hear of all your utis!  You poor thing.  I have had 2 close together and they totally freaked me out.  I had a lot of problems 9 years ago with bladder irritation but no infection found.  To be honest I ended up thinking it was all just in my mind! Then actually having blood and leukocytes in my urine scared me to death and i ended up having cystoscopy to rule out more serious problems.  You had 2 years of these and I am making a fuss over 2!  My anxiety is terrible so I always imagine the worst.  I am sure the anxiety is hormone related too. I also dont use soap anymore and drink lots of water every day take probiotics and ecinacea and also I take d mannose daily to help stop the bacteria sticking to the bladder wall. I also get acid reflux which flares up with my anxiety and all in all I am a bit of a mess!  How did you manage when getting utis all the time?  Were you still working and dare I ask are you still able to have an intimate relationship?  For me I am terrified to even think of "that" because I am so afraid I will cause the problems to worsen. 

[Hurdity]

Hi Jackanory

 

Re the vaginal DHEA capsules - these have recently been approved by FDA in US because studies have demonstrated their efficacy in treating vaginal atrophy. They are not available in UK and I would absolutely not recommend trying to make your own!! I am not sure they are even available privately here?

We have several vaginal oestrogen products available on NHS - each with different fillers - Ovestin (estriol) , generic estriol cream, Vagifem (estradiol) and the Estring ( estradiol). Along with the recommendations from Dancingirl about moisturisers I would suggest getting one of these from GP. There is minimal systemic absorption and they can be taken indefinitely

http://www.menopausematters.co.uk/local.php

Also check out Maryjane's posts about vaginal atrophy and irritation and Dancingirl's Burning Club thread in private lives.
http://www.menopausematters.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,22886.0.html

Hurdity x

[CLKD]

Tea won't make any difference  however, a large spoonful of Epsom Salts in bath water may ease symptoms. 

Vaginal atrophy needs to be controlled.  Why did the GPs not do more investigations regarding repeated prescriptions for ADs, that to my mind is laziness on the part of the GP as well as bordering on negligence!

There are several preparations that ladies here suggest with some success, including Yes and Sylc, personally I find using liberal amounts of KY Jelly or Vaseline to keep the outer lips supple and less itchy.  [anyone know why the product is called KY   .  Regular use of Ovestin1mg keeps inside moist.

[Jackanory]

I know vaginal oestrogen would cure my problems but unfortunately cannot get a gp to prescribe it for me, as far as they are concerned I have enough oestrogen because I have regular periods and they have looked at my bits and determined they are fine, this is why I am trying the home remedy, the dhea arrived this morning and I will start the treatment tonight.

Thanks for all the replies and advice but unfortunately the gps at my surgery are unsympathetic and I cannot afford to go private.

[CLKD]

That is bizarre.  Would they refuse treatment for other conditions  - have you been referred to a Consultant? [sorry if you have already said]