Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

Not a Forum member? You can still subscribe to our Free Newsletter

media

Author Topic: Biodentical HRT safety discussion on radio 4  (Read 3942 times)

Ljp

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 566
Biodentical HRT safety discussion on radio 4
« on: July 13, 2016, 12:38:05 PM »

Did any of you listen to the radio 4 discussion on biodentical HRT and private clinics?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b07jqqw1

What are your views? Does anyone know what compounded HRT is?
Logged

dangermouse

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1155
Re: Biodentical HRT safety discussion on radio 4
« Reply #1 on: July 13, 2016, 06:10:26 PM »

Compounded just means made to measure direct from the pharmacy - can be more expensive and is unregulated as cannot be monitored. Oestrogel and Utrogestan are examples of pre-packaged bio-identical HRT.

They are the first choice by hormone experts but GPs tend to prescribe synthetics first-line, so you need to ask specifically for the bio-ids... but you don't always get them!
Logged

Ljp

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 566
Re: Biodentical HRT safety discussion on radio 4
« Reply #2 on: July 13, 2016, 08:50:03 PM »

Thanks for that danger mouse, I have mirena and oestrogel, and use estring for bladder/va.
Logged

Dana

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 631
Re: Biodentical HRT safety discussion on radio 4
« Reply #3 on: July 14, 2016, 03:04:34 AM »

Bio-identical HRT (or BHRT) is not a medical or scientific term. It is actually a marketing term that originated in America by the compounded hormone industry, but sadly it has now become so widespread that the original meaning has become very muddy, and very confusing. All the discussions about it have also become very muddy and confusing, largely because that's the way the compounded hormone industry wants it to be, so that women will be even more fearful and confused about conventional HRT, which that Elizabeth woman even admitted is their competition.

Unfortunately the term "bioidentical" is even commonly used here on MM to mean the conventional "natural" hormones that GPs and specialists prescribe (like patches, tablets and gels containing estradiol and Utrogestan), so that leads to even more confusion for any woman who lives in a country where the compounded hormone industry is spreading their misinformation and confusion (eg USA, Canada, Australia). This is probably because it appears compounded hormones haven't been so common in the UK, but if they are creeping in there now too, it is going to lead to even more confusion on this forum.

BHRT (bioidentical HRT) is way more expensive than conventional HRT because they're just cashing in on all the scaremongering that has gone on with conventional HRT. The compounded hormone industry goes out of its way to confuse women, by giving very mixed information. They make statements, like this woman did, saying that bioidentical is safer than synthetic, which of course is technically true, but they always equate "conventional HRT" with "synthetic", and fail to tell women that the majority of conventional HRT is also bioidentical. They lie by omission. That woman in this interview is an example of the tactics they use. They purposely confuse all the information and definitions of bioidentical, synthetic and conventional HRT.

The other side of the debate is just as much at fault IMO because I've never heard anyone actually pin them down and confront them with the fact that conventional HRT is also "bioidentical", and that the ingredients in compounded hormones are exactly the same as the ingredients in conventional HRT. This interviewer failed to do it too. The other woman (Elizabeth Whatever) got away with still leading women to believe that all conventional HRT is synthetic.

Compounded hormones are not regulated and are made to individual prescriptions by compounding pharmacists. They use exactly the same ingredients that are in conventional HRT, but there is no one overseeing what they make to ensure they are using the right quantities or even the right ingredients. The use of compounded hormones is not advocated or recommended by any medical authority or menopause society anywhere in the world, including Australia, USA, and Canada. Quality control and non-regulation are two reasons why, but more importantly is that compounded progesterone, which is usually administered by a cream, is not effective enough to protect the uterus, like Utrogestan or progestins do.

Here are a few links you might like to read....

http://www.menopause.org.au/for-women/information-sheets/34-bioidentical-hormones-for-menopausal-symptoms

http://www.fda.gov/ForConsumers/ConsumerUpdates/ucm049311.htm

http://www.menopause.org/publications/clinical-practice-materials/bioidentical-hormone-therapy/compounded-bioidentical-hormones-what%27s-the-harm-

http://www.studd.co.uk/bioidentical_hormones.php

I'll just add a word of advice. If you want to get the conventional "natural" (or bioidentical) HRT don't walk into your doctor's office asking for "bioidentical" because very few GPs use that term, and will either have no idea what you're talking about, or they might think you are asking for the compounded hormones, and the majority of doctors will not prescribe compounded hormones. Just ask for estradiol or progesterone (Utrogestan). That will avoid all confusion.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2016, 06:47:22 AM by Dana »
Logged

Dancinggirl

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 7091
Re: Biodentical HRT safety discussion on radio 4
« Reply #4 on: July 14, 2016, 07:35:30 AM »

Fab post Dana - really informative and helpful.  I would just like to add that Utrogestan is actually listed in a GP's booked of drugs as ‘Micronised Progesterone'  - I don't think it is listed under HRT preparations (as yet) so this is why many GPs get confused when women ask for bio identical progesterone or even Utrogestan. Utrogestan is used for fertility treatment so is listed differently. Hopefully the new drug books GPs get will include Utro etc. under HRT section in the future.
So in other words; if a women wants to ask for all bioidentical at the GPs, they need to be specific and ask for either patches or Oestrogel for the oestrogen and tell the GPs that the bio identical progesterone - UTROGESTAN - may be under a different section and could be listed as Micronised Progesterone.

I would also like to add that we did have an excellent thread (I think done by Stellajane) about Utrogestan and it's side effects.  Yes, Utrogestan is deemed more 'breast friendly' but it does give many of us side effects, e.g. problematic bleeding, fatigue etc. so one mustn't assume it will be ideal for all women and the synthetic progesterones do suit the majority of women very well and are highly effective and relatively safe.

There are risks and benefits for all medications but it is about the benefits versus the risks and side effects. Doctors readily hand out ADs/SRRIs without highlighting the side effects which is highly irresponsible. The scaremongering over HRT has to stop - too many women are suffering from meno symptoms simply due to fear over safety.  When, oh when, are they going to highlight all the benefits of HRT????  Journalists love to emphasise the the dangers of everything and anything.
DG xxx
Logged

Dana

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 631
Re: Biodentical HRT safety discussion on radio 4
« Reply #5 on: July 14, 2016, 08:49:57 AM »

Good point DancingG. Utrogestan is listed as a "micronised progesterone", not a "bioidentical" progesterone. I personally think, that considering all the confusion caused by the word "bioidentical", it simply shouldn't be used if you are talking about conventional HRT. At that same time though, people do need to be made aware that the majority of conventional HRTs are not synthetic, but "natural". It all becomes so confusing.

I also think that, while "natural" HRT is obviously the best to use, women shouldn't be made to feel they MUST use it if it doesn't suit them. It's sort of a bit like women being shamed if they don't or can't breast feed. Natural is best, but not all women can do it. I'm one of those women who has chosen not to use Utrogestan, and I can honestly say I feel much better on Provera than I did on Utro. The risks of it are grossly over-exaggerated IMO. Millions of women around the world use it, and Norethisterone, seemingly without dropping dead en masse.

I also despair over all these women who are so scared to use HRT because they are still being told about the supposed risks, yet they are readily using ADs, benzos, and zdrugs, all of which have far more risks than HRT will ever have. Then we have to contend with the growing compounded hormone multi-million dollar industry that is only making things worse.
Logged

Ljp

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 566
Re: Biodentical HRT safety discussion on radio 4
« Reply #6 on: July 14, 2016, 04:20:24 PM »

Great posts ladies, and thank you for pointing out that many biodentical hormones such as estradiol and estriole and uterine stab are now offered by GP under the heading of conventional HRT.

Here here regarding WHEN are we going to start hearing more about the pros of HRT, I am using my estriole cautiously, 1.5 pumps seems to be doing its job, plus the estring, and mirena (not biodentical) for uterus protection, and I am still having episodes of health anxiety relating to the fact I'm using it, and asking myself if I could cope without it, and why?… because I'm terrified it could cause breast cancer!
Logged

Vanessa1

  • Guest
Re: Biodentical HRT safety discussion on radio 4
« Reply #7 on: July 14, 2016, 05:02:16 PM »

Thanks for this post & replies ladies  ... very informative and interesting :)
Logged

Hurdity

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 13941
Re: Biodentical HRT safety discussion on radio 4
« Reply #8 on: July 14, 2016, 05:24:05 PM »

This topic does keep coming up time and again and I presume it is because new women come across these terms for the first time! There are various threads saying the same thing if you do a search - and with plenty of links too like Dana has provided.

I haven't listened to the programme - but having listened to other programmes on HRT and looked at press articles  - I know that the journalists concerned simply don't know enough about this important area.

As Dana says the main area of confusion is between bio-identical hormones (which is a scientific term - and the correct name for molecules with the same structure as made in our bodies) and BHRT where as she says - the correct term has been hijacked by the compounding industry to sound as though it is a unique type of HRT. Clearly the few clinics that want to promote BHRT in this country are hoodwinking everyone as Dana says.

All the information needs is on this website under "HRT preparations" - so as well as using the term micronised progesterone or utrogestan to get this product, women should print off the relevant sections of this website so that no doctor can make the excuse that they can't find it, or haven't heard of it. Everything listed here is licensed for use as part of HRT.

Unfortunately as Dana say - those who read or hear about the BHRT (without knowing that most of the oestrogens are bio-identical) will get short shrift from their GPs if they ask for it and especially if the doctors themselves are not enlightened!

Hurdity x
Logged