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Author Topic: Conti Utrogestan  (Read 9143 times)

Dana

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Conti Utrogestan
« on: January 16, 2014, 05:03:55 AM »

I'm still trying to get my head around the conti method for Utro. I've been using 200mg x 12 days x 2 months, but I'd like to try the conti method, because I'm post meno and I'm frankly over having periods..lol...

I know you are supposed to take 100mg x 25 days and then have a break for 3 days, but I don't understand why you have that 3 day break. Would it cause a bleed to occur, or is taking the lower dose over a longer period of time just not allowing the lining to build up in the first place. Could I just continue to take it everyday, without taking a break, and without having any problems, or is it absolutely necessary to take a break for those few days?

The last couple of times I have done the 2 monthly x 200mg routine, I haven't had any problems while taking the Utro, but once I stop I seem to be inflicted with insomnia, which from reading some other posts here, does seem to happen sometimes. I'm sure this might be due to the 200mg because when I was just using 100mg x 12 days every month I don't recall having this same problem. Maybe this sudden drop from the higher dose has caused it. I hope it settles soon. Hopefully taking a lower dose most days will eliminate this problem.

Anyway, I stopped the 200mg a couple of days ago, so I'm just waiting for my period to arrive, so how soon do you think I could start taking the 100mg Utro without it affecting my period? Once the period starts would it be okay to start taking the Utro then. I'm still tossing up between vaginally or orally though. What is everyone's thoughts on the pro and cons of both delivery methods. Presumably while I'm having a period I will have to take it orally though.

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Dana

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Re: Conti Utrogestan
« Reply #1 on: January 17, 2014, 05:42:38 AM »

Anyone?

More than 50 views currently, and no one has any answers to my questions?
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Chrislm

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Re: Conti Utrogestan
« Reply #2 on: January 17, 2014, 08:30:00 AM »

Sorry Dana, I'm not going to be any use to you but I am also keen to know the answer to your question for a friend of mine. Her doctor has told her that Utrogestan isn't licensed for use in post menopausal women yet I know from this forum lots of women are taking it this way.

Sorry not to be any help but good luck!
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juliekim

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Re: Conti Utrogestan
« Reply #3 on: January 17, 2014, 09:24:44 AM »

Hi Dana,

I am pretty new to the forum myself.  If nobody more experienced is around to answer your question, have you thought of emailing Dr Currie herself via the forum.  It only cost £15 and you will get an answer pretty quickly.  I emailed re a query taking Utrogestan and got an answer the following day.

Julie x
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Cassie

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Re: Conti Utrogestan
« Reply #4 on: January 17, 2014, 01:15:45 PM »

Perhaps you can send Hurdity a private message, I am sure that she would have the answer to most of this query. I use the Utro vaginally, that way, I find that they have less side effects and I cannot swallow them in any case.  I think that it depends on your dose of Oestogen as to whether you would get a withdrawal bleed after 3 days but I highly doubt it as it usually takes about 5 days for the progesterone levels to drop in the body once stopping, which is what causes the lining to be shed, so you should just flow through with no bleed as a continual level dosage of progesterone should keep your lining nice and thin so no need for a withdrawal bleed.
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Hurdity

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Re: Conti Utrogestan
« Reply #5 on: January 17, 2014, 06:43:05 PM »

Hi Dana - haven't been on the forum much recently as a lot of work on including some evenings.....

I think I answered the question re the 3 day break somewhere on here the other day - not sure if you managed to find it? I quoted some papers.

I agree that it is probably to allow a bleed to happen if it the lining has built up. The idea is that conti HRT should prevent the lining building up. It shoudl be perfectly OK to take it continuously. I haven't come across the recommendation against vaginal application every day - but then it's not licensed for use this way as HRT. The French SPC recommends vaginal route if side effects on oral route.

Re the bleed - Cassie - mine comes two days after stopping the Utro - triggered by the drop in prog - which must be different for each woman. Not sure whether this would be the same if I was on 100 mg though?

If I use it vag ( or anything vag - including the Orthogynest pessaries) it affects my bladder during the night, and not sure of this happens for oral route?

Dana - I think you could start taking it asap but as you say the bleed will interfere with its uptake. Personally I would start taking it orally now - the prog level sill have dropped so the signal should have gone to your uterus to shed the lining. Adding more prog now should stop the lining further building up. You could switch to vag when your bleed stops maybe?

juliekim - it now costs £25 to have a consultation with Dr Currie

Chrislm - your friend's doc is wrong. Just print off the info from the green menu
http://www.menopausematters.co.uk/postmeno.php

and scroll down to bottom where utrogestan is listed and the dosage for post-meno.

The SPC is here too and clearly states its use for post-meno women
http://www.medicines.org.uk/emc/medicine/19895/SPC

I mean for goodness sake - if we lay women can find this stuff a doc should surely do so and not misinform people!!!

Dana - hope this answers some of your questions and good luck and do tell us how you get on!

Apols in haste...

Hurdity x
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meno lesley

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Re: Conti Utrogestan
« Reply #6 on: January 17, 2014, 09:44:02 PM »

Hi Dana

I am 55 and take utrogestan vaginally 25 days out of 28 with estrogel. I do not have a bleed on the 3 days off but did have some spotting last year which I had a scan for but showed no thickening.

Lesley x
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Dana

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Re: Conti Utrogestan
« Reply #7 on: January 18, 2014, 02:22:32 AM »

Thanks for your replies. Since posting my questions I have been doing a bit more fossicking around and I have also been talking to an American friend who is using Prometrium every day. Her ob/gyn seems to be very bioidentical savvy and has told her she can just continue to take the 100mg every day, without a break. She takes hers orally and feels this is working well for her because it gives her a constant dose without any hormone spikes. She also feels taking it every day has helped a lot with her sleep, because when she was doing 14 days on and 14 days off, she always slept better for the 14 days she was taking it.

It is now 4 days since I stopped the Utro, and I've had my period now for almost 48 hours (it's reasonably light, so it's obviously not building up too much even after 2 months), so I feel I should be able to safely start taking the Utro again. I'm still having insomnia problems, so hopefully taking 100mg tonight will sort that out. Like my US friend, I think I will feel better if I have a consistent dose, rather than experience these peaks and troughs on a regular basis. So I'm undecided about the 3 day break, because on any other conti regime you wouldn't take a break at all, so maybe I'll just take the break every couple of months and see what happens.

I am a bit concerned about potential weight gain from taking Utro all the time. I already have a stubborn weight issue that I can't seem to shift no matter what I do, but I guess if I have to make the choice between insomnia and some added weight, I would prefer the weight...lol...

I'm still undecided about oral vs vag, but I'll start out taking it orally and see how I go with that. I can always switch to vag later on. I must say though that orally seems more convenient. I can just "pop a pill" without having to phaff around, but I guess like everything in life, it's trial and error. 

For those interested, I found this info in Dr Elizabeth Vliet's "Screaming to be Heard", which I found very interesting....

Quote
I described in chapter 3 how estradiol produced before menopause is one of the primary hormones regulating the brain's sleep centre and facilitating the normal stages of sleep. When estradiol declines, the normal stages of sleep, especially periods of Stage IV deep sleep, are disrupted. So it is crucial for women to have adequate estradiol to regain normal deep sleep and muscle repair, but there are a number of metabolites of progesterone that have potent sedative effects, very similar to barbiturates and benzodiazepines.

Remember the compound I mentioned in chapter 3 called, 3-alpha-OH-DHP? It is about eight times more potent than the sedative methohexital, a potent barbiturate used for anesthesia. The liver provided most of the conversion of progesterone to these sedative compounds, so the sleep-inducing effects of progesterone will be increased if it is taken orally and goes through the liver “first pass” metabolism. So progesterone does have effects on brain receptors that help sleep, by acting like the medications you may already know like Valium, Klonopin, Ativan, and others in this group.

Progesterone's effect on sleep is quite different from estrogen effects, so just taking progesterone doesn't eliminate the need to estradiol to restore sleep pathways, as some books claim. Since progesterone can make you sleepy like Klonopin does, there may be times when it can be a useful addition to hormone therapy even if women do not have a uterus, but this has to be balanced against the unwanted, potentially negative metabolic effects of progesterone that I have discussed elsewhere.

Some of the metabolites of progesterone have greater sedative effects on brain receptors than Klonopin. If progesterone is used to improve sleep in women with fibromyalgia, I find that lower doses can be effective, provided estradiol has been restored to optimal levels. If you have a uterus, however, you and your doctor have to be certain that you are taking an appropriate dose of progesterone for the desired protective effects on the endometrial lining.

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Suzyq

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Re: Conti Utrogestan
« Reply #8 on: January 18, 2014, 03:37:36 AM »

Hi Dana

I'm in canada and my specialist prescribed 100mg to be taken every day or 200 mg for 14 days then 100mg for the other 14 day (I have zero progesterone!) so I'm sure it's okay. I have chosen to do just 14 days of progesterone as I am still peri-menopause and although I feel much better when taking the progesterone, it does cause me a lot of bloating - like really a lot!! I take vaginally, but he recommends orally as it really helps with sleep, so you should be ok. Hope this helps!
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Chrislm

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Re: Conti Utrogestan
« Reply #9 on: January 18, 2014, 09:16:20 AM »

Many thanks Hurdity. I knew this was the case!
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Dana

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Re: Conti Utrogestan
« Reply #10 on: January 18, 2014, 09:22:50 PM »

Hi Dana

I'm in canada and my specialist prescribed 100mg to be taken every day or 200 mg for 14 days then 100mg for the other 14 day (I have zero progesterone!) so I'm sure it's okay. I have chosen to do just 14 days of progesterone as I am still peri-menopause and although I feel much better when taking the progesterone, it does cause me a lot of bloating - like really a lot!! I take vaginally, but he recommends orally as it really helps with sleep, so you should be ok. Hope this helps!

Thanks. Still no improvement on the sleep front, but I guess I will have to be patient for at least a few days.
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Dana

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Re: Conti Utrogestan
« Reply #11 on: March 09, 2014, 03:05:05 AM »

Just thought I would give an update on this issue, for anyone else who is interested in this routine.

I started using 100mg Utro orally on 1st Feb. Almost immediately everything improved and I was sleeping really well. So well in fact that I didn't even think about stopping it after 25 days and taking a break for a few days. However, when I got to day 26, I started to experience sleep problems again, and they have gotten progressively worse over the last week.

It suddenly occurred to me last night that this problem started exactly after the 25th day (the day you are supposed to take a 3 day break). Now maybe this is just a huge co-incidence, but it does seem very strange that it would happen right at that time. Maybe my body is saying “enough already with the prog!!”, and maybe this is why it is advised to have a break.

Unfortunately because I only had this epiphany last night, I have been continuously taking the utro for this extra week. I've stopped it today and hopefully if I take a break for a week or so things will get back to normal. I've always suspected I have a bit of an issue with progesterone, so perhaps this has proved that I do.

So new plan - I will take 100mg for 25 days, then I'll take a break for at least a few days to give myself a break from it for a while. Of course I'm out of kilter with the 1st of the month now, but hopefully I'll eventually get into a routine of taking it from the 1st-25th of the month, and then stop until the first of the next month which will give me a 5-6 day break. What kind of effect this will have on any bleeds will be interesting, but as long as my sleep is okay I can live with whatever happens.
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Sarah2

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Re: Conti Utrogestan
« Reply #12 on: March 09, 2014, 08:01:47 AM »

Have you thought about increasing the oestrogen you take? It's low oestrogen that gives me insomnia and that was the reason for my taking HRT- I just can't function or work properly with constant lack of sleep. I noticed a difference within about 4 days of starting Oestrogel, on a long cycle regime.
« Last Edit: March 09, 2014, 08:21:19 AM by Sarah2 »
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Diamonds and pearls 53

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Re: Conti Utrogestan
« Reply #13 on: March 09, 2014, 08:11:31 AM »

Hi Dana,thanks for the update-I was going to make the same suggestion as Sarah 2.What type (and dose) of oestrogen are you taking?
Diamonds and pearls x
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Dana

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Re: Conti Utrogestan
« Reply #14 on: March 09, 2014, 10:46:54 PM »

Thank for the suggestion, but I don't think it's the estrogen. I'm using 50mcg estradiol patches, and when I'm not taking any prog at all I'm fine most of the time. It just seems to be the prog that is the problem, and working out the best method to suit me.

When I've tried using 200mg x 12 days x 2 monthly, I would be fine while I was taking the prog, but all hell would break loose for about a week after stopping it, until my levels returned to normal. I think the sudden drop from the 200mg is just too much for me.

In the past I have also tried 100mg x 12 days x monthly, and that worked okay, but I was hoping to find a method where I could be period free. If this new plan doesn't work out, I'll have to go back to using it monthly for the 12 days. Although fingers crossed the 25 days, and a week's break, will work okay.

My situation is slightly different to the norm because I am also slowly weaning myself off a very low dose of diazepam, and that can have its own side effects too. I should have that done in the next few months though, so then I'll really be able to work out a proper plan, without something else in the mix.

sigh.... what us meno-ladies have to go through......
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