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[Penguin]

Also to say, and I don't think we discussed this in our messages, but my issues started exact same way. The spikes causing no appetite at all, feeling dreadful, a lot of weight loss. My BMI went down to 18. All came back on when I took hrt for 16 months though. Peri can definitely cause loss rather than gain which is unexpected.

[CrispyChick]

Thanks ladies

This is helpful.

Bombshell - yes I tolerate desogestrel ok. Well I say ok, but the reason I was no longer on it after it took this down years ago was because I was getting horrific moods on it. Lately when retrying I got the moods but also a lot of bad bloating. It's an interesting theory - but I think double dose would finish me off. I'm so sensitive to everything.

Thanks penguin. Yes, still in the ED group. I'll look that up. So your symptoms started like this, but have now naturally calmed a lot, after stopping the hrt?

That's all I want. My E to tank. There are herbs that do this, but again, my insides will not tolerate any hormonal movement. I think I've messed way too much.

I'm about to go on holiday - absolutely dreading it. But it will give me the time to just let my body be and see where it naturally is on nothing. Very scary right for me. I stopped cerazette on Mon. Been in hell since. But I was also on hell on it.

I know you're much preferring being on nothing penguin. Any idea what level your E is at??? But I know you also suffer from low E at times - something I don't have. In fact, if this hell was cyclical, I'd prob give it a shot. But it's every single day. 

[Penguin]

I don't know yet, they were very high via Dutch in April (both E and P), but I am retesting in mid August so will let you know then. I defo think I've had a cyclical dip as this month felt dreadful when my period came, all low E symptoms plus the dryness which hasn't actually gone yet and is a bit annoying.

But yes, it is how my peri started. Couldn't eat, couldn't gain weight, was a nervous wreck, had morning nausea a lot, some reflux. Improved when started hrt for first few months but then as you know it sent me over the edge again with high E (not just spikes). I also couldn't tolerate progesterone although,  to be fair, I have only tried utrogestan. If I ever needed it again, I'd do Mary G's route of compounded and control the dose. I feel your pain, high E is awful.

[CrispyChick]

Thanks penguin.

So you're now in a better place than you were on nothing before hrt???

That's all I'd hope for. I don't expect miracles. I'll take loads of my symptoms but I cannot tolerate feeling poisoned, vile, motion sick, dizzy with absolutely no appetite. It's all unopposed E for me.

It's hideous. 

[AngelaH]

Hi Crispy,

It’s hard to say what is the actual cause of your suffering. It is possible that you are dealing with highly sensitive body issues. In fact it’s not so rare problem as I thought before. When the body is too sensitive to sex hormones every little change in their production may cause feeling like you have significant imbalance, but in reality it so little that any other body would never even notice it. In this case adding standard NHS doses of hormones may causes symptoms of too much and only teeny-weeny doses may help. If you believe you need only progesterone, you may be better off trying using very microscopic dose.

[CrispyChick]

Thank you Angela.

Yes. I do believe I have a sensitivity that others do not feel  .

I've tried prog only for the last 2 years and can never get it to work. Tiny doses trigger estrogen receptors to be one more sensitive. It's a known thing. And boy ive been through it many a time. And I can just never get out the other side. I was doing this with bhrt progesterone.

It was taking standard utro for a few days that triggered my, now ongoing, stomach distress. So now I can't take any prog. 

I absolutely think I'm over sensitive to all the changes - but I guess that's why I'm wondering if shut down might actually help. Eradicate the changes. Even if I need tiny dose add back. 🤔

[sheila99]

Can't help with your decision but perhaps a question to ask before you decide. If you go for the chemical meno it's likely you'll want to add back some oestrogen. If you can't tolerate any progestin does this mean your womb lining becomes a problem?

[Penguin]

Hi Crispy,

It’s hard to say what is the actual cause of your suffering. It is possible that you are dealing with highly sensitive body issues. In fact it’s not so rare problem as I thought before. When the body is too sensitive to sex hormones every little change in their production may cause feeling like you have significant imbalance, but in reality it so little that any other body would never even notice it. In this case adding standard NHS doses of hormones may causes symptoms of too much and only teeny-weeny doses may help. If you believe you need only progesterone, you may be better off trying using very microscopic dose.

Totally agree with this re sensitivity to even small variations!

[CrispyChick]

Yes. But what to do about it???

[Penguin]

Thanks penguin.

So you're now in a better place than you were on nothing before hrt???

That's all I'd hope for. I don't expect miracles. I'll take loads of my symptoms but I cannot tolerate feeling poisoned, vile, motion sick, dizzy with absolutely no appetite. It's all unopposed E for me.

It's hideous. 

Yes, I'm in a better place now on nothing. Being on the right AD has also helped I'd say, but I feel much more level I  my hormones now apart from the end of the month dip. I don't feel poisoned anymore and I know the feeling you mean all too well.
But saying that I do also take DIM and sulforaphane which I think you said your tummy can't tolerate? I believe they, along with calcium d glucarate helps my body detox E a lot better than previously so it isn't constantly recirculating.

[Penguin]

Yes. But what to do about it???

Remind me pls, have you tried the compounded route where the doses are smaller?

[CrispyChick]

Yes. I was with the Marion Gluck clinic.

I've tried tiny doses and bigger doses. I defo think I need about 50mg. But can no longer tolerate any on my stomach. Not even a smidge.

I'm glad your poison has subsided. Yes, absolutely the dim and sulphoraphane and CDG will be helping. I had good success with a sulph blend, but within days my stomach was in carnage.

I think it is absolutely right I feel every small increase/decrease. So, whilst E is poisoning me. I also feel the dips pre period. I get horrific dizziness and full ears.

It's all so awful. Which is why my only option on the table is now to shut it all down.

Yes. I'm I credibly scared of any add back. But I guess the stable dose issue is key. Sheila - I can take progestins fine. And, I used to tolerate prog fine on my trials, but now my insides are over sensitised. In time, if it's all shut down, I might tolerate again. Although I don't want NHS doses of P. So that might always be an issue. 

[Penguin]

Oh wow I get full ears too! Thought it was just me

[CrispyChick]

Oh. When do your ears get full??? Mine seems to be with the changes. Pre period and first few days of cycle really bad.

Sometimes bad dizziness with it.

It's just all hell. 

[AngelaH]

Crispy, what is the smallest dose have you tried? I am asking because when I say microscopic dose I mean it’s microscopic. 50mg can kill me. Mirena coil delivered about 20 micrograms in my uterus daily in my peri. How much of that ended up in other parts of my body? I think we can talk about 0.5 -2 micrograms only. I really don’t know exactly but I’m sure it’s very microscopic amount. That was enough to treat my peri symptoms. Now I am post meno, I use the weakest product which I can find from NHS and online and I cut recommend doses to unbelievable small sizes and this is the only way to keep myself going.