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Author Topic: Thyroid concern or meno?  (Read 31063 times)

Furyan

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Re: Thyroid concern or meno?
« Reply #15 on: October 23, 2023, 01:58:57 PM »

Hi ladies and thank you!
Wrengsong tbh I was so anx yesterday that I started wondering if my current symptoms could be thyroid but deep down I don’t think so.  My latest TSH from GP was fine.  Back in May my free Thyroxine was slightly under but apparently this can happen.  I am having awful sweats and palpitations/racing heart which waken me, iv no energy and feel v down and anxious.  My menopause specialist has changed me to patch but just on that over 2 weeks so too early to judge.  Covid last year had a big impact on my hrt and iv struggled on &!off since.
Peanut lab ranges were
TSH 0.27-4.2 (mine 2.79)
Free T3 3.1-6.8 (mine 4)pmol/L
Free T 12-22 ( 11.6) so just under
I asked GP to test the free T again but they just do TSH and thst again was fine not long ago.  I don’t think it’s that.  Sorry to hear you have all that going on.
I feel my estrogen & T just crashed a few weeks ago, I hadn’t felt good for few weeks and then I just literally went down full stop!
Tk you CLKD and Sarah T

Hi Floral - I too have an underactive thyroid, for which I’ve been treated over the years. Without going into too much detail, my thyroid ‘crashed’ a few weeks ago with the same symptoms you described and I was so weak I haven't been able to perform even basic daily routines for myself. Went to A&E who did TFTs and was told they were fine. Basically they weren’t as my free T3 (FT3), whilst ‘in range’, was far too low for me to function. It was a little lower than yours is now. I know this because I immediately stopped taking Levothyroxine and went back on Armour thyroid, which I had previously taken without a problem, and my symptoms are gradually but notably getting back under control. It’s been a frightening experience but my point is, your FT3 looks relatively low to me and it’s possible that, like many other people find, it’s not optimal for you personally even though it’s supposedly in range.

In my years researching thyroid treatment, eyeing up results and speaking to other hypo sufferers on forums like some ladies here mentioned, I’m conscious that mainstream medicine often misses the importance of FT3 despite clear evidence that it’s the biologically active and therefore most critical hormone to test and have at optimal levels to function. Like some suggested, try joining a forum where you can learn more about the thyroid and get some guidance around how to have a conversation with an NHS professional about what you learned. And about your options if that doesn’t work! Try looking up Thyroid Patient Advocacy online too. You join the forum to post a question but the people there are very knowledgeable and generous with their time.

To answer the title question of this thread: many symptoms are blamed primarily on sex hormones/HRT when, for thyroid patients, they may be primarily thyroid related. It’s worth investigating further, as now I’m on the right thyroid treatment, other symptoms are easing that I thought were due to menopause.

Don’t give up hope, my story isn’t necessarily yours, but the information you’ve shared warrants further investigation and you’re worth it x
« Last Edit: October 23, 2023, 02:03:25 PM by Furyan »
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joziel

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Re: Thyroid concern or meno?
« Reply #16 on: October 23, 2023, 02:05:23 PM »

Floral I echo what peanut said.

If you need more help with thyroid stuff I recommend thethyroidclinic.co.uk  They are who I'm with for it all and are great. They will probably want to re-test you with a venous draw and include rT3 (which Medichecks doesn't offer). You can order the blood tests from their website and the pack will be sent to you and then you go to your nearest phlebotomist to get them done (they will give you a list) and post them off. Then you can have your appointment after that, so they have the bloods done beforehand.

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Floral

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Re: Thyroid concern or meno?
« Reply #17 on: October 23, 2023, 02:26:51 PM »

Girls you are all AMAZING on this forum!
I am so grateful to you all who posted back and I am going to get tested because I have been and felt so unwell! 
I will look into the sites you have recommended and get going!
Onwards and upwards🤞X
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Floral

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Re: Thyroid concern or meno?
« Reply #18 on: October 23, 2023, 02:50:16 PM »

Furyan,

What is armour thyroid and why were you on lev? Sorry but I’m in no way knowledgeable.  Did you get treated privately? Thank u
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Furyan

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Re: Thyroid concern or meno?
« Reply #19 on: October 23, 2023, 06:15:15 PM »

Furyan,

What is armour thyroid and why were you on lev? Sorry but I’m in no way knowledgeable.  Did you get treated privately? Thank u

Hi Floral - Levothyroxine is what the NHS mostly prescribe to treat hypothyroidism, which I’m diagnosed with. It is a synthetic compound. Armour thyroid is just one of several naturally derived thyroid medicines (from pigs) that people were routinely prescribed decades ago to treat the condition. The medical profession generally stopped prescribing it in favour of Levothyroxine because they assumed (on the basis of limited research) that EVERYONE could be effectively treated with the latter. The pharmaceutical companies also push this assumption fiercely. However, the hypothyroid population appears flooded with individuals whose symptoms are not controlled effectively on Levothyroxine alone i.e. some continue to feel ill or even worse. Some decide to get natural thyroid themselves or get it prescribed by knowledgeable practitioners. At some point, Armour was recommended to me by a friend because I too continued to experience symptoms on Levo. Within months of returning to Levo, I’ve crashed …

But all that is for background information only, as you asked. For now, I’d focus on finding information and support using any of those forums mentioned. Knowledge is power is autonomy when you know how to use it. You’ll at least have a broader perspective of your issues and be able to form a plan for a way forward. x
« Last Edit: October 23, 2023, 08:45:19 PM by Furyan »
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Wrensong

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Re: Thyroid concern or meno?
« Reply #20 on: October 23, 2023, 07:54:59 PM »

Hi Floral, only just caught up with this thread & I see you've had lots of advice from other thyroid patients, so I won't add much.  I'm also long term hypothyroid (nearly 30 years) & on both T4 & T3.  Thank you for posting more detail of your TFTs.  Your FT4, as the others have said, was low in May & some people do need a lower TSH & higher T3 to feel well, but it's not a one size fits all rule.

Quote
I was so anx yesterday that I started wondering if my current symptoms could be thyroid but deep down I don’t think so.
I think your instinct is important & if you have had a very recent change of HRT, regardless of thyroid status that may be causing or adding to your current symptoms.  Given the low FT4 I would at least try to get a full TFT done again together with thyroid antibodies & take it from there.

I hope you find the answers you need, either in some of the advice in this thread or as has been suggested, on one of the thyroid forums & that you'll soon be feeling very much better.
Wx
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Floral

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Re: Thyroid concern or meno?
« Reply #21 on: October 25, 2023, 10:52:58 AM »

Hi ladies,

I have sent away for a blood pack and a consultation with Thyroid uk.  Does anyone know if my treatment (.if any) can be funded by nhs?  Have any of you had any experience? Many tks
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Jillyboo

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Re: Thyroid concern or meno?
« Reply #22 on: October 25, 2023, 11:25:16 AM »

My TSH was stable around 2.5 for decades on a lowish dose of thyroxine and I felt absolutely fine. After the second dose of the AZ covid jab it shot up and I had to go onto a higher dose of medication. It's now bordering on 0. I feel no better, no worse! Not sure if I'll be told to drop the dosage again at some point.
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Wrensong

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Re: Thyroid concern or meno?
« Reply #23 on: October 25, 2023, 12:00:41 PM »

Hi Floral
Quote
Does anyone know if my treatment (.if any) can be funded by nhs?
If it turns out you need Thyroxine then yes it is prescribed on the NHS.  Given your TSH & T3 were within range & you've only had one test with low T4, there may be other reasons it was below range on that one occasion.  Sometimes we can get transient changes in thyroid function & the situation later rights itself with no treatment needed e.g. when we have had other "non-thyroidal illnesses."  If you do need Thyroxine, most people do well on it & don't need additional medication containing the other thyroid hormone that's sometimes prescribed (known as T3) so please try not to worry.
Wx
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Peanut31

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Re: Thyroid concern or meno?
« Reply #24 on: October 25, 2023, 02:17:11 PM »

Hi

You may struggle to get Levothyroxine under the NHS if your TSH is below 10. Unless your GP will treat by symptoms not blood results.

If that is the case, don’t let him start you on 25mcg, it is too low. Go for 50mcg, hold at that dosage for 6-8 weeks then test your thyroid again TSH, T3 & T4, but don’t take your thyroid tablet 24 hours before the test, and test as early in the morning before 9am.

Then keep increasing your levo by 25mcg each time, again testing every 6-8 weeks at a time.

This was my experience and many on thyroid forums have the same issue with the NHS even endocrinologist.

They don’t look at the full thyroid picture being TSH, T3 & T4.

This is why many people resort to self medicating.

The problem you may have is, your TSH is within the acceptable ranges within the NHS guidelines, and they are obsessed with TSH only which is wrong.

Your GP may not agree to this thyroid medication despite your symptoms.

They will probably not take into account your own private bloods either.

However, it is important to get those tests done so you yourself can see what is happening.

My own thyroid story, very briefly is I felt very unwell for a long period of time. Told thyroid blood tests “normal” accepted this and thought nothing of it, told to go on anti depressants, refused.

Asked for blood results my TSH was 8, told had to wait until it got to 10 before help.

By the time my TSH was 10 I was a zombie, hubby had to help me dress and functioning normally was a struggle.

By this time I was sick of being fobbed off. I researched, joined thyroid forums desperate for help.

Eventually I was put on levo by the NHS, hoping this was the miracle I needed. It didn’t help, so cut a very long story short, and with the support from thyroid forums,  I am now on levo and NDT.

 NDT I self medicate, many thyroid patients do

NDT use to be given to thyroid patients, before levo was manufactured, but patients don’t always get on with this as it is synthetic.

NDT is natural desiccated thyroid tablet that contains both T4 and T4.

Levo only contains T4. Many patients cannot convert T4 to T3 and that is why they don’t do well on Levo.

Another thing to add, when GP’s see your TSH go to 0 (suppressed) they get nervous and lower your dosage, again focusing on TSH results only to up your TSH.

This makes the patients feel even worse.

I cannot express how important vitamins play in the support of your thyroid too, don’t over look those. Make sure you take vitamins and don’t go for multi vitamins.

You have been given lots of good knowledgeable advice already, just research, research, research.

Good luck & take care.
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Wrensong

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Re: Thyroid concern or meno?
« Reply #25 on: October 25, 2023, 03:08:43 PM »

Peanut
Quote
Many patients cannot convert T4 to T3 and that is why they don’t do well on Levo.
I'm among that subset with a conversion defect & I agree a form of T3 containing medication is essential in our case, but I thought it was generally agreed that the group of patients needing T3 is only 15% & that the vast majority - 85% of patients, do well on Thyroxine alone.  Am I out of date with the stats do you know?  Floral has told us she is, understandably, anxious & while there is a lot of helpful, detailed info on this thread as you say, I feel emphasising the problems some of us have encountered could be overwhelming to someone who has not yet been diagnosed with a thyroid disorder.  It's possible her low T4 in May was a blip & I'm hoping this is the case.
Wx
« Last Edit: October 25, 2023, 03:25:37 PM by Wrensong »
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Peanut31

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Re: Thyroid concern or meno?
« Reply #26 on: October 25, 2023, 03:30:26 PM »

Hi Wrensong

It is not my intention to make Floral feel overwhelmed, and I hope she doesn’t.

I know when I felt so poorly and starting looking into things, I actually found comfort in knowing others experienced similar things and would share their own experiences.

It’s down to those people with their advice on the forums that I got better.

As already mentioned it could be a vitamin deficiency too.

Luckily for me, if you look at it as lucky, my thyroid issues started a long time before my menopausal journey, so know it wasn’t anything to do with the menopause.

Best wishes & take care









« Last Edit: October 25, 2023, 03:31:58 PM by Peanut31 »
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Wrensong

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Re: Thyroid concern or meno?
« Reply #27 on: October 25, 2023, 04:05:35 PM »

Thank you Peanut31.  I just felt a bit alarmed for Floral when I came back to this thread a few days ago & saw how much detailed & quite advanced info had been posted since I'd asked her whether she would mind posting her ref ranges & I worried that it might be frightening for someone new to the possibility of thyroid disease, who perhaps just needed the basics at this stage.  I didn't want her to worry prematurely if you see what I mean, but I absolutely agree that sharing our stories can be invaluable & I'm glad to know advice & support from thyroid forums played an important part in helping you get better.   Like yours, my thyroid journey started long before menopause but the combination has been tough which is why I try to look out for women with both conditions. 
Keep posting  :)
Wx
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Furyan

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Re: Thyroid concern or meno?
« Reply #28 on: October 25, 2023, 04:48:14 PM »

I agree that some of the replies on this thread are touching on “advanced” information, but I felt that Floral’s questions were also insightful ones, the answers to which inevitably touch on concepts beyond the basics. All issues to do with the endocrine system are potentially complex (hence the many threads on this forum) and it’s hard to strike a balance when trying to help without overwhelming whoever posts a question. The thyroid is complex and contentious enough on its own so it’s great to signpost to other sites, as at least people can access broad information and process it in their own time.

Having said all that, Floral, I can see from your replies that you’re finding some of this helpful. It’s brilliant that you’ve ordered some tests! Just come back here for a sounding board if you feel the need. You’ll get there if only because you’re actively on it! x
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Wrensong

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Re: Thyroid concern or meno?
« Reply #29 on: October 25, 2023, 05:10:14 PM »

Furyan, yes I agree endocrine matters are complex (and then some!)  I did see that Floral was very grateful for all the info everyone had posted, so hopefully my worries were groundless, but I was mindful of what she said early on, that she didn't think her symptoms were due to a thyroid problem
Quote
Wrengsong tbh I was so anx yesterday that I started wondering if my current symptoms could be thyroid but deep down I don’t think so.  My latest TSH from GP was fine. . . . I asked GP to test the free T again but they just do TSH and thst again was fine not long ago.  I don’t think it’s that.
& not wanting to stress her further at this stage, potentially unnecessarily when she had already said she was anxious & she'd had only one TFT that was slightly abnormal.  I just sort of felt the thread had run away with itself a bit if you see what I mean.
Wx
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