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[Jodaisy]

Hello everyone, I'm new here, aged 54 and I started HRT in June. I use 2 pumps of Oestrogel and 100 mg Utrogestan orally. I'm also hypothyroid and I take 100 mcg levothyroxine. To begin with everything seemed to work really well. At the 3-month point I found some of my former symptoms were creeping back and the GP gave me permission to increase to 3 pumps of Oestrogel if I felt the need. But then the symptoms became less noticeable and I stayed at 2 pumps. However in the last few weeks my hair has been coming out in clumps when I wash it, and also I started to get very sore shoulders and joint stiffness. I experienced extreme pain with a minor foot injury. I felt as if I was going to get a period, and kind of as though my body had been "pumped up", if anyone can relate to that. I also felt very low and miserable. I asked for blood tests - the GP is looking at full thyroid panel, Vitamin D, FBC, B12/folate. I can discuss this tomorrow. Of course if the thyroid levels have gone haywire I might need a levothyroxine dose increase. But the last 2 nights I stopped the Utrogestan, as I am not supposed to have periods anyway and I had done 20 days of the 25 I am prescribed. And the symptoms are not so bad. I think these symptoms might be caused by the Utrogestan and I wonder if increasing the oestrogen dose would balance this out? Interestingly a few years ago I used the Mirena coil and had to have it out for similar reasons. I am interested to hear the experiences of others - I hope to speak to the GP tomorrow and the blood tests may make everything clear, or not. Has anyone else had this?

[CLKD]

As oestrogen levels drop the muscles may become lax = aches and pains.  Making sure that foot wear is suitable can help: pain in the feet may cause the body to compensate which impacts from the feet upwards.  Getting rid of any sloppy shoes/slippers might be useful.

There are several threads on hair loss. 

[Flossieteacake]

Hello and welcome to the forum. I do not have any advise but just wanted to welcome you. I hope your GP appointment goes well.

[Wrensong]

Hello Jodaisy    Just really wanted to hold out a hand as one thyroid patient on HRT to another. 

With both thyroid & menopause in the mix it can be difficult to work out cause & effect so it's very helpful that your GP is doing bloods to try to throw some light on your situation.  You'll know that hair loss can result from thyroid imbalance as well as joint & muscle pain & a whole load of other fun symptoms & it's just possible the HRT is affecting the way your body handles your thyroid replacement, even though your oestrogen is transdermal, which is said to be less likely to cause issues for us.  Possible too that your HRT needs tweaking.  The pumped up feeling - do you think this could be due to fluid retention?  HRT can cause that & so can insufficient thyroid hormone as you'll know, I'm sure.  You don't mention whether your GP is testing your oestradiol level to see how well you're absorbing the gel, but that would also be helpful to work out what might be going on.

I also have probs with Utrogestan & in fact cannot tolerate it at all, but I'm really very progesterone intolerant in general & many women get on fine with Utro.  Your past experience with Mirena does seem to suggest you too may not respond well to progestogens, but there are other types you can try if need be, in due course.  Please don't give up hope, it's early days for you & there are many options as regards tweaking HRT & if necessary your thyroid replacement.  It's not unusual for us to have to try several regimens before we find our best fit.

I think the bottom line is that we need to see what the bloods show, so if you feel like sharing, please post again to let us know.

Wx

[Clarella]

Hypo patient here too!

Hard to tell without tests but it’s good to keep an eye as obviously oestrogen can impact thyroid levels. However, it can vary - literature says transdermal doesn’t and infact oral utro can increase t3 conversion.

However I found it to groggying so have used vaginally for a long while.

Hair loss can be hormones or thyroid - I do know hair won’t grow if someone on thyroxine is low in zinc.

When I started hair stopped falling out. I’m not sure I’m on enough now as there’s now a little at times. I can struggle with slight ankle swelling at first when I raise, have to go carefully up. I am also getting thyroid tests soon as I did go from 125/150 alternating days to 125 a few months ago but not sure if some symptoms are back or if it’s hormones! Or if i need testosterone

As you know with thyroid it can take a good 3-4 months for symptoms to settle following changes. You could request a blood test to check you’re absorbing the oestrogen.

If my joint pain doesn’t improve in the next 2 months I’m going to be asking about testosterone or increasing oestrogen. She said they prefer 400-600 but based on previous tests I doubt it’s that.

[Pleasantlyblew]

Just an idea but I found swapping taking my thyroxine to nighttime was the key to being able to tolerate my oestrogen. It may not be the same problem as you but sometimes just experimenting with the timing of doses of different medications can have a big effect 

[AKatieD]

Also on HRT and thyroid meds (altho T3).

I have had to almost double my throid meds after starting HRT and when my thyroid is low be I get random severe aches and pains. Just a thought...

[Wrensong]

Hi AKatieD, that's interesting re the need to double your thyroid replacement, though unfortunate for you too, so I'm sorry it's caused probs for you.  I've also repeatedly had to alter my thyroid meds (on T4+T3) in response to adjusting HRT in order to optimise both.

Can I ask please, is your oestrogen transdermal or oral?
Wx

[AKatieD]

Oestrogel so transdermal

[Wrensong]

Thanks AKatieD.  So another member who's found that even transdermal oestrogen messes with their thyroid replacement.  There are a few of us whose experience is at variance with the articles that say only oral causes issues for hypothyroid women.
Wx