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[KarineT]

Hi Everyone,

I think a lot of you won't agree with what J have to mention but I believe HRT doesn't let the body adjusts itself to a lower level of oestrogen & progesterone.  I know that a number of women cannot function without HRT but it overrides what the natural hormones are doing in the body and there really isn't any way to tell when the menopause has occurred.  Also, when a woman decide to stop the symptoms, more often than not, come back causing, perhaps, a 'second menopause' .  I am not on HRT and I'm just hoping that I will never need it.  I hope that things will settle once I've reached the menopause.  So far, I haven't had a period since January this year and I think that I'm well on the way to reaching the menopause.

Karine

[CLKD]

One doesn't get a 2nd menopause which literally means the last monthly period.  However, it's not often realised until at least 12 months after the last bleed that we have got there.  Mine waxed and waned for years B4 I knew I was in menopause.

Ladies use HRT to ease debilitating peri-menopause symptoms, some will take it for Life.  Not even worrying about where they might be in the menopause journey.  Some stop the treatment, find that symptoms still overwhelm them so restart.

It's a personal choice.  If one isn't having symptoms then there's no need to take HRT.  I've not needed it apart from treatment for vaginal atrophy. 

[KarineT]

Hi CLDK,

It is indeed a personal choice wheather to take it or not.   So far my symptoms are low mood, anxiety, dizzyness, joint/muscle aches, waking up in the night from time to time but no hot flushes.  I get chills instead.  I have embarked on a CBT programme for the low mood and anxiety but I'm not sure if it will help.  Negative thoughts enter my mind and I am learning to challenge them but it's hard work.  It feels like my head is going to explode.  As for HRT, can it be prescribed through the NHS for the rest of a woman's life or are they reluctant to let you have it for that amount of time?  I've always wondered.

[Pinkjan4288]

Slightly sanctimonious post op.
Just because you don’t want it doesn’t make you a hero.
It’s not weak to get medical help to get through the menopause.

Some women sail through it others don’t.

And yes, some women will stay on it for life.

[KarineT]

I'm not saying that I can rise above those who need to take HRT.  I, myself, have  got issues with the menopause, mainly on the emotional side of things and it's not fun every day.  I'm just hoping that I will sail though the menopause naturally, that eventually things will settle and I won't need HRT as I don't want to depend on it for rest of my life.  Menopause symptoms cannot be a forever thing.  There's no way the body will never adjust itself to a lower level of oestrogen and progesterone as a decline in these hormones is inevitable and natural.

[CLKD]

Your list of symptoms are typical of peri-menopause.  As oestrogen levels drop so muscles may become lax = aches and pains.  The body may become dry inside and out  : skin, vagina, nostrils, deep in the ears, scalp ........

I think it's about how much symptoms impact on a lady's life . If pain relief eases aches and pains that's fine.  Vaginal atrophy can be eased with appropriate localised treatments.

We have the access of choice and yes, HRT can be used for Life.

[sheila99]

Why do think of menopause so differently to other medical conditions? If you had cancer I assume you'd have treatment, if you were deficient in vit d or b12 you'd take what the doctor prescribed. Yet when you're deficient in oestrogen you don't want replacement oestrogen? Personally I don't see the point in suffering when you don't have to.

[KarineT]

It's the low mood and anxiety that bother me.  I am not entirely sure if HRT can help with that.  Also, on here, some ladies have issues with Utrogestan as it can lower the mood significantly.  We can't compare the menopause with cancer, cancer is an illness that is often life threatening, menopause is not an illness.  That's a natural phenomenon that every woman, who had a reproductive cycle, has to go through but, unfortunately, it's not symptomless for the majority of women.

[Paz23]

If a woman gets symptoms when she stops taking HRT she would still have been having those symptoms at that point in her life had she taken HRT or not. You need to go and look at Dr Louise Newson’s website to get the facts instead of making it up yourself.
Menopause is not an illness in itself and many women manage without any “help”, I don’t particularly like it being compared to an awful disease like cancer. Menopause is a natural and normal thing that every woman has to go through - cancer is not!
HOWEVER - the symptoms can certainly feel like a crippling illness, I myself am really struggling at the moment with the physical symptoms of peri which in turn is causing huge anxiety. If there is something that can help me through this that is “safe” (and given my age hrt is safe). Yes it probably would mask what is going on in my body and I say say bloody good cos what’s going on is crap!! 
As for things like cbt and antidepressants if they work for you then great but personally I prefer to treat the cause not the symptoms. Cbt and other therapies that are designed to treat mental health problems are not necessarily going to work when the cause is completely physical.

[Floo36]

I am still in shock at how ill both mentally and physically the menopause has made me, I never imagined it could make you so very ill. It is an individual experience, everyone I know is experiencing it differently and to varying degree’s of severity. 

[Catcc]

Agree with Floo36.  It has come as a massive shock to me too.  I had no issues during peri.  Managed the menopause itself with diet, healthy lifestyle and supplements.  I refused HRT as I felt I should manage it "naturally", thinking that once the flushes were gone my body would settle and that if I looked after myself I'd be fine.

Then (a couple of years post Meno) the reality of my post menopausal life hit me.  I went from being an active, healthy, young woman to feeling like I was 100 virtually overnight. Genitourinary issues, crippling joint pain, osteopenia, insomnia and many other niggling issues.  All of this in spite of leading a healthy lifestyle, exercise, doing all the right things.

If I'd known then what my life would be like now, I'd have started HRT a few years ago. 

I have a friend who's older than me who has had no issues setting into post menopausal life.  It's the luck of the draw I guess

[racjen]

As someone who has suffered from menopausal depression and anxiety so badly I've taken two overdoses, my feeling is that I'll take whatever alleviates these symptoms, whether HRT or drugs. I've found that HRT helps with the depression but not the anxiety, so I've ended up on ADs for that. I do agree though that talking therapies like CBT don't really help with this - it's a chemical imbalance and no amount of talking changes that, in fact I've just ended up feeling frustrated and patronised, because therapists tend to be so focussed on there being a psychological cause they find it very hard to take the hormonal issue into account.

[ElkWarning]

It's tricky isn't it.  I rocked up here (to these forums) after I'd been on HRT for a bit.  My life was going seriously haywire.  I was stressed out of my mind.

Before HRT I'd had the usual ups and downs, aches and pains.  I decided to try it because my whole body hurt all the time and I thought I was experiencing early onset dementia.  The difference in those first few months was amazing.  I actually had a functional memory.  Endless agony abated.  And I got on with life, more energy, better skin, more like the old me.

^^ My issue was that the old me was the problem in the first place.  I was constantly over extending myself.  Never left any space for R&R.  Had sat in an office / studio for years on end and allowed my body to atrophy.

So I did a weird thing.  I stopped taking the HRT.  I was fully expecting everything to come flooding back.  And sure enough, some of it did.  My memory is, once again, shot to pieces, like bad on a scale that I didn't even think was possible.  Hot flushes, check.  Painful joints, check.  Rollercoaster emotions, check.  Wanting to die, yeah, some days it was (occasionally is) shit.

I saw a herbalist, who took an actual clinical history (90 mins of chatting) and prescribed me treatment.  Two weeks later, the hot flushes went away, along with this almost volcanic heat I'd always gotten in my head when I was upset > angry.  I started being able to sleep properly.  I can't tell you what a relief that finally was.  And I began seeing a therapist, every week, long term, I'm now on my 16th month.  Don't ask me why, but I hadn't realised that my son being born with a life threatening and life limiting condition had produced levels of trauma in me that were absolutely unmanageable.  He's 27 now.  I have OCD.  I get easily overwhelmed.  I'm learning to say 'No'.  Turns out I'm rubbish at this.  My trauma therapy has taught me that I'm not broken, and so I don't need fixing, instead I have to figure stuff out ...

Now I take hours every week for R&R - moods are a lot better.
I did couch to 5k - speedy walking, not running for me, no more aches and pains, much fitter and moods are a lot better.
I took the decision to completely change careers - I don't want to sit in an office for the next 15 years of my life, so I'm retraining to be a history teacher.
I bought myself a brand new motorbike and learned how to ride it, passing my theory test last week and looking forward to my practical next year.

^^ This is for me, and for now.  It might change.  That will depend on how I feel.  HRT wasn't a good thing, probably because I wasn't in a good place, but that doesn't mean it'll never be a good thing.

[KarineT]

So HRT is not a miracle cure and it does not work for everyone.  I will never be able to understand why the menopause is a lot more that just the end of your reproductive cycle and hot flushes.  Now I realise that having a hard with it or not is the luck of the draw but it's really not fair on those who are suffering.  I believe that I'm peri as, although I haven't had a period since January this year and I turned 50 this month, I haven't reached the 12 months without a period yet.  If CBT does not work, how come it can help someone who has depression?  Do you think emotional issues are caused by just hormones?  If so, it's terrible but it cannot possibly last forever otherwise it's like mental torture.  When I was still having my periods, I was having emotional issues  but the mood would lift much quicker.

[Paz23]

Cbt doesn’t “cure” depression. It gives you coping strategies so you can manage the negative thoughts and therefore feel more able to cope. And it doesn’t work for everyone - it was next to useless for me.
Depression as a mental illness and is a chemical imbalance in your brain - the kind of depression/anxiety caused by the menopause is down to a dificiency in sex hormones (mainly oestrogen) so the two things are not the same. However, menopausal symptoms can be bad enough to cause depression/anxiety (the chemical imbalance type) - I’m still trying to figure out which mine is!