Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Ladybt28]

I am not sure that I can add anything that will help other than you all know I have been where each if you are in terms of symptoms and problems other than my menopause being surgically induced.  I got rid of my AD's after over 30 years and will never take them again despite the fact that like CKLD I was told I would need them for life. I have been under the mental health team and done CBT 4 times over the years.  I have had one to one counselling for 8 weeks at a time - 4 times over 30 years, phoned the Samaritans and Lifeline on numerous occasions. The only thing I can say is that fixing my hormones has taken coming up 3 years! since I worked out that had been the problem since I was 13.  After all the years and all the problems it has not been a quick fix to sort out and in fact 10 years ago when I was just into peri I was convinced that was my life from then on and that there was no solution (other than death which was a serious consideration, I had my letter to my family on my computer where it remained until Sept 18), but I didn't know it was hormonal then. I still wouldn't put myself in a category which says I am sorted and settled, just that I can go more than 3 days without my head crashing and the crash is less than before, plus nearly all my meno symptoms have gone. but I now don't get so far down I can't get out.

As GypseyRoseLee and MaryG testify there is hope but it can be a beyond long haul racjen and it can take many turns.  Actually it was the ladies here who stopped me being the inpatient person that I am, because the frustration of not being able to find an answer was making me worse. After 40 years I wanted it fixed and I wanted it fixed now! but it has taken 6 whole months to get to 3 ok days so all I'm saying is that the results of something can take a very long time depending on how complicated the case.  I have not been to see him but I did phone Professor Studds clinic about an appointment in August last year because as far as I am aware he is the leading person regarding hormonal depression and I live in Northern Ireland!  I didn't go because I went to my local meno clinic and discussed his regime (and others from what I had learnt here) with the consultant there and got their opinions. Luckily they were ok with it but I was fully prepared to go.

I just want you to know there is hope - you just have to try everything you can find but you must do each tweak over a period of 3 months before changing.  Patience and hope thanks to the ladies here - not least MaryG who PMd me and GypsyRoseLees posts because they had similar experiences to mine oh and many others CKLD Hurdity and names too numerous to mention.

[Tc]

Lady. It's so reassuring to hear you say you don't get so far down you can't get out.and that there is hope.

After many many years  i was diagnosed with EUPD emotionally unstable personality disorder. .something I only found out when I saw my notes

There have been times when i have been relatively well and functioned well but other times my life has fallen apart. It seems traumatic situations seem to lead to breakdown and recurrences of an eating disorder I've had since a teenager and OCD. They are linked to the EUPD. My doc lists clinical depression and chronic anxiety as seperate but I think it's all linked.
I even ended up in an eating disorder clinic at the age of 45. I was the oldest one there but it now makes me wonder if the age was significant and how much hormones might have been at play all my life without me realising it.
.
I was saying on another thread how the frustration and impatience of hrt balance taking time had made me feel even worse i dont cope well with change and uncertainty so it's so very  important to hear from ladies like yourself.

 I know your reply wasn't for me but I hope you don't mind I just wanted to say thanks. I've been on here a few months but have kind of slowly revealed my  Mh background as I guess we learn to do for fear of being labelled I never ever tell anyone new about the EUPD. Even most of my friends don't know.  So thank you for being so honest.

[CLKD]

Group 

[Ladybt28]

Thanks for your kind words Tc - I have found that there is no problem sharing anything on the forum however bizarre or weird it sounds when you right it down because no one judges.  It think it is because we are either all suffering so badly with our own trials and tribulations and backgrounds and circumstances that we ourselves are not in any position to judge anyone else! So don't ever worry about what you need to say.  Plus I think it's easier to tell people stuff in writing because they can't see your face!  The forum is the one place in my life I have told the pure unadulterated truth about how I see my life and how I feel.  Lots of the  ladies here know more about me than most of the limited amount of people in my life.  Post away Tc - it's cathartic and helpful instead of keeping it bottled.

Personally in hindsight I agree with you about the emergence and diagnosis of mental health conditions and other weird stuff for women at the age of around 40 plus, that I think the first line to be checked with GP's is to rule out hormonal issues before going on to anything else.  You could be right about your timings for stuff in your life being hormonal. When I was 28/30/35 (around 1990) I kept telling my doctors I thought there was something wrong with "in balance in my body somewhere" causing my "issues" which could best be diagnosed in todays parlance as Chronic fatigue/ME and or fibromyalgia plus permanent chronic depression and anxiety and they treated me like I was an idiot. I also put forward theories which no 20 plus years later that I thought overuse of antibiotics as a child for 10 years had caused some in balance  (it is now proven that they affect gut health which can affect mental health!) but of course no - I was an idiot AGAIN!  To be honest I was actually way ahead of my time!! lol. but it didn't help me because I spent the best part of 40 years with no life at all and no enjoyment from life and struggling to control my mind every day which was in fact being controlled by my body not working properly.  No amount of CBT or mental health stuff or AD's have every shifted it.  It started shift very recently which just proves hormonal depression is a real thing!  Dont worry about this label EUPD - psychs love them - let me tell you that for more years than I are to say in my head I was a total failure and felt like the world went on around me and I was in a separate room and couldn't join in.  In the last 12 years there have been more times than not where I have been a hysterical, crying, ranting, anxiety ridden totally certifiable nut job  with some brilliant displays in GP's offices and still they didnt clock the connection to hormones!  Probably because I was on Hrt albeit the wrong one and they dont know enough to work out that  hrt doesnt work the same in everyone!

Since this meno thing has come into play and all the learning I have done, things going way back seem now to make perfect sense and now it appears I could actually start to rejoin the real world. It's scary I can tell you, because I have to go right back 44 years to remember when things were "right" and life was ok.  It's like learning to live all over again because I cant remember what "right" supposed to feel like.  I dont use the word normal because who of us and what is "normal"? All I can say is about the hope thing and the patience thing because until a year ago I was convinced as I had been for 40 years there was no hope.  It takes patience and thought and the will to keep looking for the answers.

[Tc]

Ladybt. What an amazing reply. So full of insight
I am so sad that you have had such a struggle for so long but I'm so glad for you that things are looking a little brighter.

I too have felt labelled by my Mh diagnosis  by the medical proffession and I definitely felt that it was a very convenient hook for docs to hang medical symptoms over the years.

In my 20s what turned out to be glandular fever was put down to depression 
Shingles  well at first that was just my anxiety giving me a rash.
I got sacked from a job in the early 90s
When gp refused to back me up that I was physically unwell until I got a second opinion, was referred to Barts and diagnosed with M.E.

Many times I've left the surgery crying. I used to think if I went in there with my arm hanging off they would say it's anxiety/depression.

Most recently I had been to docs several times with bloating. Pelvic pain, wind  and acid reflux. All put down to anxiety. "Take a course of anti depressants and come back in 6 months.

I went back in 6vmonths (didn't take the ad's)  and saw a locum and suddenly it was all systems go!! Scans; ca125 test. They were classic possible  symptoms of OC. Luckily the locum followed the nice guidelines.cos a large tumour was discovered and I was very quickly referred to gynae/oncology.and had surgery.

I was one of the lucky ones and my tumour was a Dermoid  I  mention this not to go on about myself but because if it hadnt been benign the initial "it's all anxiety come back in 6 months" diagnosis could have wasted very precious time.

I remember when I had M.E. one day just shouting at the doc." DEPRESSION ISNT CAUSING MY SYMPTOMS. MY SYMPTOMS ARE MAKING ME DePRESSED".
Fast forward to a few weeks ago when I had cause to repeat the very same to GP when she said "you are anxious and depressed ABOUT  menopause"

Sorry it's a long post but If what you and I have been through, and cobviously we are individuals, but if it resonates with anyone else then its a reason to speak up. I hate to think others might suffer as I have and I feel you have for so long

One final thing im gonna say in this post whilst im getting it off my chest

 There is something i have bever been able to fiorget and i think it perfectly sums up what im trying to say. :

A particular GP had been positively nasty to me when I sat in his office crying and I refused to see him again. ..but..

When my wife was dying from cancer we found ourselves in front of him at her appointment  he couldn't have been more different with her and he turned to me and said "see, I know when someone is realy ill"

I didn't complain. All my energy and focus was on my wife at that time.

But wow.

[CLKD]

That was a totally un-necessary comment and made because he knew you didn't have the energy to retort, how awful.  I don't know why people go into the profession unless it's to be nasty and on a pedestal, pretty much like those that go into other professions to pry on children.

[Ladybt28]

The trouble with the ignorant GP's is that they rely on tests to prove a theory and when they don't have those or the condition can't be "proved" by tests they get their knickers in a twist! Tc  The likes of ME/Chronic Fatigue/depression can't be diagnosed with a simple test.  Thyroid tests and tests for stuff like Lymes Disease are notoriously unreliable and basically the NHS cant think outside the box.  If they did they would save a fortune!  for example when I went to the chemist yesterday to get my testosterone the young pharmacist called me over and with a furrowed brow said "do you know how to use this" to which I replied "oh yes" and went on to explain that I knew it wasn't licensed for women, that it was pea size amount to be used, that you didn't dose it as was on the label that it is now becoming mainstream as part of treatment of meno along with progesterone and oestrogen and that it was given by a meno consultant.  As I was speaking the furrows disappeared she said "I have to ask because I have never known it to be given to a women before"!  "its really good that you told me all this  stuff because I would have no idea and now I will know for the future"!  Jeez I despair of the medical profession - any of them why cant they keep up to date and such a young one as well, she couldn't have the excuse of "they didn't do that when I trained". 

Not the pharmacist in particular but just generally I cannot believe the words that come out of the mouths of medical professionals who ought to know better - they are unbelievable sometimes and in any other job they would be sacked on the spot!
You are spot on with yelling the "depression isn't causing my symptoms my symptoms are causing my depression" but the GP is wrong when she says you are anxious about menopause. I knew perfectly well my head wasn't causing the problems my body was. With a real clued up meno specialist and there are only a handful about they would know that anxiety, depression and the long list of other symptoms that is on this website are all meno symptoms or hormonal in-balance symptoms.

You had trouble with the surgery getting your gel and utrogestan if I remember right but you have what you need now right??
Maybe things you thought about your health which seemed written in stone before will start to shift for you too.  I am 57 and feel I wasted nearly all my life.  Any meno Dr trying to take anything off me now because of my age is gonna have some task in front of them!  I feel I am just starting my life. 

You probably dont warrant half the labels people have come up with and I hope that's the case for you - anyway bin them out of your head they are not helpful 

[CLKD]

The Pharmacist was correct as it's off licence for women I believe?  So hopefully she will make notes and absorb what you explained to her Ladybt - well done!

[GypsyRoseLee]

What a spiteful and frankly childish remark from that GP. More proof that too many HCP don't believe in hormonal/reproductive depression, and thanks to their ignorance they consign too many women to suffer needlessly.

It was only when I finally read Prof Studd's website that I finally connected the dots between my 30 years of odd moods and occasionally outrageous behaviour to my HORMONES.

The only times I have suffered with any MH issues was during times of hormonal upheaval.

1. Just before I reached puberty I inexplicably suffered with sudden night terrors and feelings of doom (I was lucky to have enjoyed a happy childhood until then). Luckily these issues didn't last long, but were replaced by...

2. PMS sometimes quite bearable, others months I would suffer sudden rages, feelings of hopelessness, and instigated huge rows with various boyfriends. I could be a nightmare, I admit. Taking the Pill made no difference and often made it worse. Infact...

3. Starting a new brand of the Pill when I was at university caused a sudden awful flat mood and depression which lasted 8 months, with no relief. Everyone told me it was the stress of studying and exams ( except I enjoyed studying and always performed well in exams). I don't think it a coincidence that when I changed to a different brand of the Pill the awful depression lifted and I was 'just' left with PMS once a month (for a whole bloody week).

4. Having my first baby - within 2 days of giving birth I knew something was very wrong. I felt so flat, filled with despair and just didn't see the point of living. Within 3 weeks I was diagnosed with severe PND and my lovely Mum had to virtually move in with us to help take care of the baby. I was prescribed ADs but it took months to feel better, and 2 years before I felt fully recovered.

5. Finally, as I turned 40 I noticed my PMS was getting steadily worse and lasting longer and longer. By the time I turned 42 I was only getting maybe 10 'good' days each month. Then in Oct. 2013 the PMS didn't go away and it felt so much worse, just never ending. By Dec. 2013 I thought I was having some sort of breakdown and my GP diagnosed me with anxiety and depression (except I loved my life, absolutely nothing was wrong). Then suddenly the madness disappeared and I was fine for a few weeks. But then the madness came back, then went, then came back...I never knew from one day to the next how I would feel. I thought I was losing my marbles, no one knew what was wrong with me. ADs didn't seem to do much. I did some research and found my way to Annie Evans and she started me on 2 sachets of Sandreena gel + Utrogestan but I think it was too little, too late. I totally crashed. Couldn't bear leaving the house. Got signed off work and was referred to the Crisis Team. Suicide was never far from my thoughts. I was in such a dark place that I was terrified all the time. It was unspeakably bad. The psychiatrist I saw tried me on Trazadone which did nothing, no matter how much they upped the dose.

Eventually it was seeing Prof Studd and getting access to high doses of oestrogen which saved me. I feel better now than I ever have, really. My mood is so, so stable all the time (aside from a very occasional dip) and I feel calm and quietly cheerful. No more PMS. It's so lovely.Looking back I'm sad that I have lost so much of my daily life to hormonal interference and I hope that awareness of this illness or disease (because that's what it is) grows.

[CLKD]

Have a hug GRL!  I too had PMT for several years and eating regularly helped.  Every 3 hours 24/7.  Took some getting used to but the puppy soon cottoned on 

[Tc]

Ladybt28. Your experience at the pharmacy omg!! Wish I could say it shocks me but at least she will know better for next time.

Thank you for remembering bout my hrt. Finally got new regime scrip picked up and gonna start in the morning

I feel I want to talk to you about couple of things you said in your post to me  but if you don't wanna talk about it I understand

First  About the feeling you said  you have "wasted your life."
 I so get it and I have felt angry, regretful and guilty for the amount of  time I  spent Ill  with so called mental health issues which I ultimately blamed myself for but I  would clling onto believing that i had time to turn thungs around. Then cane meno. Suddenly I felt I've missed the boat. I
 had so much to offer which I didn't do

I've had all the counselling about not "ruminating" a psychologist/psychiatrist word  along with "catastrophising."   No meaning in the real world. Oh and on my records 1 ^year after my wife of 21 years died "abnormal grief."  Just words  i  think I've become numb to all the pyschobabble.

I am trying to realise but i have hard time with it. when ppl i know say things I have done are interesting or I have helped them, made them happy or contributed to their lives. I tend to disregard all that cos I ultimately hate myself and always think I could've done  better  and that's not pyschobabble that's me speaking from this, hopefully,  still besting heart.
.
 The logical part of my brain accepts that if  spend the next 10 years regretting the last 40 I'm only gonna end up in another 10 years wasting the previous 10 regretting the last 50 ...you might need to read that again. I did. But i hope youi know whst I mean.

Ladybt something else you said:

 "I feel I am just starting my life.".

I get it's a double edged sentiment but..

May I ask what that feeling means to you and if you would want to elaborate on that?

As I said please don't feel you have to share anymore than you already have. I appreciate so much  you have shared so far and I sincerely wish you so much for now and the future x x

TC

[Droopeydrawers]

Ladies can I just poke my oar in to say what beautiful caring posts and how lovely of you to share your deepest fears and experiences with others who are maybe too shy or fearful to share but can relate.well done and im not going to go into details but just wanted to say there is light at the end of that tunnel we've all had some kind of turmoil in our lives.mh or otherwise and you can and will get past this.im coming up to 62 now and from age 25 onwards had experienced most of what your discussing and only got through it because I had the love and support of a good man and still do.Keep up the good vibes and support you are fab.DD😘

[Tc]

Droopy. No oar poking here  thank you for sharing. Xxxx

[Droopeydrawers]

 😘

[Ladybt28]

I will answer your post Tc and am happy to share and expand, but it will have to be later this evening.
Didn't want you to think I was ignoring you.

Thanks Droopydrawers and GRL for your support  - it is so good to know that there are others in the world who have had similar experiences.  I have been a constant battle in my head from a reflective point of view when I look back at my life which we all do as we get older and I thought till I came here to the forum, that the state of my life was somehow because of the choices I made but I am now aware that the choices I made and the events surrounding it happened has pretty much entirely been influence by my health. I'll tell you more about why I wrote "wasted" when I have more time!  Working at the moment