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[allie007]

Morning ladies
Sitting here in tears, I feel like i can't take much more, I have't slept more than 3 hours a night for nearly 3 weeks now and my headache won't go away. I haven't had a headache like this since I started HRT.
I swapped straight over from 3 pumps of Estrogel to a 50mg Estradot patch 3 and a half weeks ago. After 2 days and for the following few days I felt amazing, on a total high, thought I'd cracked it with my HRT.
That lasted a few days and slowly my symptoms have been coming back and have come crashing back so badly I haven't been able to work this week. I did go to the doctors on Thursday and theyve upped my patch to 75mg. Chemist didn't have them in so Ive used 1 patch and cut one in half following advise from Hurdity.
I know its still early days but I really can't cope with so little sleep.
Strangely, my mood is ok which I found it wasnt with Estrogel but I slept ok with it, still woke up but I could get back off to sleep. On this patch im awake most of the night. Doesnt matter of I get an early night, I just wake up earlier.
Out of desperation Ive used a pump of gel this morning, alongside my patch. I'm wondering if that initial high that I had when I changed over was because I still had the Estrogel in my system and perhaps I'm someone that needs a high dose? I feel as bad now as before I started HRT.
I was 'diagnosed' last March, FSH level of 70, GP is presuming I am post meno. Am 47 now. I also use a Mirena and had a new one fitted in August. I havent had a period for about 4 years but this could be due to Mirena.
So sorry for the essay, I've got no one to ask advise from and my doctors are close to useless.

[Rhiner]

Hi Allie, Sorry to hear this. Its difficult with sleep if its too little or too much E. I have had both, when it was too little i couldn't sleep at all, when too much I got over for a couple of hours straight away and then wide awake rest of night. I also started with headaches and think its because the dose was too high (thats when I switched from tablet to patch). I really feel for you! R x

[allie007]

How are you feeling now Rhiner?  What made you change from the tablet? Hope all is ok now x

[Rhiner]

Hi Allie, I am absolutely fine now but it took a while. Was on Femoston and after 8 weeks my E level had built up (as I started from nothing has had my ovaries removed), and I think it was then too much, as this is when i was waking after 2 hours sleep and had really bad headaches. I saw a meno specialist and he moved me on to oestrodot patch plus Utrogestan(didn't introduce Utrogestan until I was absolutely sure that I was on the right level of E, which took around 8 weeks). As soon as I cut down Femoston dosage I could sleep better.  As I understand it you are on Mirena so I guess its hard to know whether its Oestrogen or Prog that is causing the headaches, for me I feel it was the synthetic prog in Femoston.

You will get there its lots of trial and error, (and for me a damn good specialist)!
Rxx

[paisley]

Allie007
Sorry you aren't feeling good. What is happening when you try to go to sleep & wake up? Is your mind buzzing? I find I fall asleep ok but wake about 6 hours later with a buzzing mind.
I know you don't want to hear this but 3 weeks still isn't long enough to give your HRT time to settle. Also by adding an extra blob of oestrogel you are giving your self more fluctuations. I started a new patch nearly 3 weeks ago & having ups & downs. Had a cold last week & some major stress & felt awful this week but that is down to the cold & stress. I know it is hard but we have to give it longer. Xx

[allie007]

Thank you all for replying, i'm so grateful.

Im wondering if I do need to see a specialist. I see a different doctor every time I go and I don't know who they are and they don't seem to know what to do for me. One of them had to leave the room to go and ask a more senior doctor what to do. Thanks to the advice on here I seem to be be more informed than them.
I used the gel this morning because i did get some benefits from it within days when I started on it and I've had nothing from the patches. I can't cope with how awful i feel and can't cope with 3 hours sleep. Yes,my mind is buzzing when I wake up.
I feel too ill to work. Ive worked 2 days this week and each time i've gone in Ive cried because im so exhausted. I'm a supply teacher and if I dont work i dont get paid. We don't get sick pay either so I have to work.  I need to be well.

[allie007]

Thank you Birdy, I will definitely try Magnesium. Is there a particular make or strength you would recommend?

[Ladybt28]

Have always been prone to sleepless nights well before meno but on this journey I have suffered with mega bad insomnia at various points and in the past, usually due to my head behaving like a washing machine rinsing thoughts constantly or due to ridiculously high levels of anxiety.  Tried sleeping tablets from Dr which were a no because they made me feel groggy and sick also the over the counter sleeping tablets from Boots same thing - like a hangover!  Now when I can't sleep I use valerian drops which is herbal from the health food shop - works a treat - no hangover feeling - take 1 hour before bed - sleep like a baby!

You put 20 drops in inch and half of water - tastes a bit weird smells a bit like hops but works.  You can get valarian in tablet form also.  I've tried loads of things this works the best.

[Peroxideblader]

hi I really sympathise with insomnia I've had 7 years of it but I'm the other way I can't get to sleep til around 4am have to be up for 830 it's totally ruined my life and my health..I'm tearful depressed run down but haven't started hrt again since femoston when it turned me suucidal on the oestrogen part.
I have tried EVERYTHING but can I ask about that high dose of magnesium..I took advice for type and dose and it was 2 x 100g magnesium glycinate before bed but 2000 is that not too high ?

[aspie65]

I am a stuck record about Pregabalin but it really is a good drug for sleep (and anxiety).  Unlike the usual sleeping pills you will not get a 'hangover'.  It is not as strong as a regular sleeping pill but it will make you sleepier and it can be used long term safely.

[NorthArm]

Hi allie007

Have you thought about Mirtazapine to help you sleep? I take 7.5mg about an hour before bed, and it knocks me right out. (It's an AD that helps with severe anxiety, the therapeutic dose is 30-45mg, but at very low doses can really help with sleep). There's also melatonin if your dr will prescribe it.

My partner is a dreadful snorer, so I sleep in the spare room now too. It took about two weeks with Mirtazapine, melatonin and earplugs and I was sleeping through again. I stopped the melatonin after about three months and my sleep has been pretty good. I have tried to sleep in with him again, but I really can't cope with the noise, tossing & turning, and getting up three times a night to pee, then woken by his alarm at 4.30am (all him). So I made a choice to put myself first, lol my need for sleep and sanity far outweighs his desire to keep me close!! My room is as black as pitch too - I use pillows to block out the light under the door, and have blockout curtains. As were in summer time here now, I'm thinking of investing in a sleep mask too xx

[Peroxideblader]

I sadly I've tried mirtazapine and pregablin but it gave me nausea and has the opposite effect u was wired shaky and weird..I find that with most drugs they just don't work for sleep for me.
I also moved into a spare bedroom 4 years ago my partner snores off for the scale in every position and when I started to lose my ability to get to sleep I put up with 3 years and moved to another room. it didn't help me get to sleep but at least at 4am I can get some. we both live it because I'm up and down peeing and night sweats so he wasn't getting enough sleep either. now we go to bed together have a chat and cuddle then our sepirate ways til morning..

[Ladybt28]

I don't think GPs in the UK prescribe melatonin Northarm but it is much better than the actual medication you can get, I agree.  You can get it over the internet and I buy it from America to use alongside my Valarian drops if I am really really wound up or I know I absolutely have to go to sleep because I need up early for something important that cant wait!  It is the natural substance we secrete to go to sleep and wake up - its the one that reacts to the light

[NorthArm]

We can only get 2mg prescribed here in Australia, so I bought 10mg tablets online at iherb.com - I found them very good and will still use them from time to time xx

[allie007]

Hi everyone, thank you so luch for your replies, I really appreciate it.
Decided to take my little boy away for a couple of days this week as its half term to spend a bit of quality time together. Been feeling like such a rubbish mum lately because I havent been my normal self.
I went back to the GP last Monday, actually managed to see the gyny  'specialist'. Long story short is she tried to talk me into taking anti depressants which I refused so she very reluctantly upped my Estradot to 100mcg. Very obvious that she wasn't happy to do that. This was the same GP that told me that I wasnt to use more than 2 pumps of Estrogel when I was using that, and I also HAVE TO come off HRT when I'm 52. She's also referred me now to an HRT clinic and an appointment has come through already for 22nd Nov.
I am sleeping better thank goodness on the 100 patches, still waking up but managing to get back to sleep whereas  I wasnt before  xxx