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[knorman]

Morning Kathleen

Due to a mouth health issue, my anxiety levels and panic attacks took me to the brink of a nervous breakdown. I am unable to take HRT and went back to Dr for help as all my usual mental and physical strategies were not working. I was prescribed anti-anxiety meds, which were told would help with night heats and sleep as well. Took one at bedtime, slept right the way through (night heats ALWAYS wake me up, as we know, that is their job!), felt like a zombie next morning and they made my original mouth problem worse. I have CFS/ME and my body has rejected every medication recently. However!  It completely took away the feelings of panic, I stayed that way for a few days on the one tablet and it seemed to reset something. I decided not to take anymore because of the mouth issue, but the fact I have the packet sitting in my bedside table reassures me that if the anxiety becomes too bad, there is something there to help me.  So far I have not touched them, but I did take them out with me last Saturday.  We had a fairly long journey to take in the car and I become claustrophobic in traffic jams, especially in this heat. I didn't need them. Sometimes, just knowing there is a little something tucked away to help you is all you need to keep you going.

We are all so different and have to find whatever works best for us, but I hope everyone's different experiences gives you something to draw on and find a solution x

[dangermouse]

You are quite right CLKD, all anxiety is anxiety in how it's experienced. However, with something that has an ongoing feed to it (as opposed to the broken leg scenario) then the cause becomes  important as you need to know the cause in order to change it.

If it's down to unhealthy thought processes then they can be reprogrammed in therapy and removed completely.

If it's down to low serotonin then SSRI antidepressants can help.

If it's down to high blood pressure, or an underlying heart condition, then heart meds can help.

If it's down to volatile hormones then correcting hormonal imbalance can help.

Etcetera.

Sometimes it's a combination of 2 or 3 causes where, for example, underlying psychological anxiety can be amplified in perimenopause by the volatile hormones.

Unless you are completely aware of the cause then it can be down to trial and error and perhaps a combination of therapy and medications.

Something strong like Diazepam can act as anaesthesia to shut down stress hormones completely and will be experienced depending on tolerance. I was given a quarter tab of it and had a rebound bad reaction as it wore off an hour after I took it and the GP I was taken to said it was because benzodiazepines calm the mind (so more for neurosis) but I simply needed my adrenaline and tachycardia brought down as my thoughts were not triggering the anxiety (he could tell by how calmly I spoke) - to which he prescribed beta blockers as and when. I only ever took 4 or 5 over that first month as I discovered it was my hormones that were the root cause and the pill and then progesterone cream rebalanced me and took me out of the crisis state.

It can be very difficult to figure out, in the moment if it's a neurosis or physical, however, when it hits you completely out of the blue then that is a good sign it's not thought driven.

[CLKD]

   Both.    Both.

Sadly my Doctors weren't concerned with why my depression took over in 1983.   . I really wanted to know if it was physical or due to genetics. [alcoholic grand-father, gambling gt grand-father, hyper active uncles and a depressed father; maternal granny with what was probably PNT and agerobophia!]

[racjen]

I'm not sure it's true to say that all anxiety is anxiety in the way that it's experienced. My observations from talking to  people of both genders with psychologically derived anxiety are that it tends to have recognisable triggers, often rooted in past experiences, and that this makes it possible to predict when it will be exascerbated and take measures to head it off. It probably is also more likely to manifest as panic attacks too. It will usually respond to talking therapies like CBT, EMDR, psychotherapy etc. Hormonal anxiety on the other hand has no trigger or focus to set it off, it simply comes on at a regular time (usually first thing in the morning) and drains away as the day goes on. No amount of talking therapy sorts it out because it's a physical problem which needs a physical solution ie hormonal treatment. I'm sure it's not uncommon to have a combination of the two, which obviously complicates things enormously, but I think it is important to acknowledge that there is a distinction in both cause and experience, because the treatment needed is different in each case.

[CLKD]

   that makes sense.  Though in menopause it does have a causation, i.e. hormone surges.  Cortisone ? maybe part of the problem?

My anxiety is instant.  Nothing in my head at all despite what a Psychologist tried to push onto me: "You must think of something B4 you being to panic". Well, no.  Actually.  It happens.  In my gut then my thighs go weak followed by my calves and then I'm on the floor.  Within seconds.  Then curled into a ball, shaking.  Then my head kicked in 

[Sgtvhilts]

I have suffered anxiety since childhood, but It didn't become problematic until my early 20's.
I was never keen on benzo's, knowing a few people who liked them a bit too much,
So i did propranolol for a while, but that didn't stop the anxious thoughts.
My gp at the time was very good. She suggested that as i had always been that way an ssri might be more useful, i also did relaxation therapy (excellent)
A lot of people don't rate the ssri's well, but for me they were amazing- literally changed my life and stopped completely the anxious thoughts. I have been taking them on and off for 25 years-addiction may come to mind- but i would say who cares , it is better than life crippling anxiety.
Benzo's may be okay for a crisis, but they really are not a long term option.

[CLKD]

SSRIs are in general non-addictive.  Some may need to be withdrawn slowly as I did B4 I swapped over to another.  It was the head zaps that puzzled me  .  The brain is an organ that needs support as any other.

[racjen]

So what's the difference between something being addictive and needing to be withdrawn from slowly? Surely if you need to withdraw slowly to avoid nasty withdrawal symptoms that implies addiction? There may be a difference in terminology here but it's all the same in the end....

[suzysunday]

I was on seroxat which is an ssri ,.for 12 years and I thought I would come off them slowly over 6 months, but it was far too quick and I went through hell.  I should have gone back on them then come off them over a couple of years but I didn't realise.  I think if a thing is addictive it loses its effect on the dose you are on so you have to increase it, like heroin, to keep getting a buzz. But non addictive substances can still cause withdrawal.

[racjen]

I think there's a myth that if something is so-called 'non-addictive' you'll be able to come off it just like that, with no adverse effects. Yes, you're right that, strictly speaking, being addicted to something means you develop a tolerance to it and have to keep increasing the dose to get the same effect, but it's misleading to make out that drugs like SSRIs won't cause problems when you decide to come off them - many people get terrible withdrawal from ADs.

[Shadyglade]

There is a difference between addiction and dependancy.

Addiction generally means that emotionally you like the way a drug makes you feel and crave it when you don't take it.

Dependancy means your body becomes dependent on the effects of the drug and you get bad physical symptoms when you decide to stop taking it.

These two are often confused.

[Conolly]

Hello Kathleen,


How are you doing? You've been silent...


Conolly X