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[Hurdity]

Because of the unavailability of some of the testosterone preparations there has been quite a lot of discussion recently about comparability and which T product is best for women. This is not for me to say – they are developed for men after all – but I have drawn together some basic information (below)  about concentration, ingredients, and size of dose so it's altogether in one place which I hope is helpful and will save me writing it out each time someone asks!

The main thing is that Tostran is twice as concentrated as the 1 % Testogel and Testim so for those using a very small amount ( eg tube/sachet) lasting 2 weeks, it can be more difficult to give a consistent amount as  variation either way will give more or less to a greater degree than with Testim or Testogel.  For those who have higher doses this is probably less of an issue – and may not be an issue anyway – but just a thought! The amount dispensed in each pump of Tostran is very small – only 0.5 g gel (10 mg T) so easier to get closer to the right amount compared to Testogel  (1.62%) pump pack – despite Tostran being more concentrated.

The Testogel 1.62% pump pack is more concentrated (by 1.62!) than the sachets but each pump contains 1.25 g gel or 20.25 mg T so unless each pump of gel is transferred to a syringe and dispensed from there it's difficult to gauge the right dose (which going by the totals would be approx 2/3 the amount of Testogel).  However Besins state that 2 pumps of the 1.62% Testogel (40.5 mg T) is approx equivalent to 1 sachet of the 1 % gel (50 mg T)  (in terms of absorption in men) so maybe less than 2/3 would be needed?

Testosterone gel products currently available (that are prescribed to women)

Tostran 2 % gel (20mg T/g gel) Pump pack

One gram of gel contains 20 mg testosterone.
One press of the canister piston delivers 0.5 g of gel containing 10 mg testosterone.
3x per week = 30mg T
1 pump on alternate days would give same amount of T as Testogel sachet or Testim tube lasting 10 days
(Starting dose for men: 3 g gel (60 mg of testosterone) applied once daily)

One tube of 5 g gel contains 50 mg of testosterone.

Testogel 1 % gel Testim 1 % gel

For a Testogel sachet/Testim tube to  last 10 days (large pea-sized blob) would give 35 mg per week = 5 mg per day
(Recommended starting dose for men is 5 g of gel (i.e. 50 mg of testosterone) applied once daily )

Testogel 1.62% gel Pump pack

One pump gives 1.25 g gel = 20.25 mg testosterone

To dispense smaller amounts of these would need to decant 1 pump into syringe?

(Recommended starting dose for men is two pumps ie 2.5 g of gel (i.e. 40.5 mg of testosterone) applied once daily )

Hopefully I haven't made any mistakes but let me know if so!

Ingredients

Tostran
Propylene glycol
Ethanol, anhydrous
Isopropyl alcohol
Oleic acid
Carbomer 1382
Trolamine
Butylhydroxytoluene (E321)
Water, purified
Hydrochloric acid (for pH adjustment)

Testogel
Carbomer 980
Isopropyl myristate
Ethanol 96%
Sodium hydroxide
Purified water

Testim
Purified water
Pentadecalactone
Carbomer 980
Carbomer copolymer
Propylene glycol
Glycerol
Macrogol 1000
Ethanol
Trometamol


Edit 11.6.19 - Testim has been discontinued for a year
Edit 18.11.19 - Testim 1 % gel seems to be available again but manufactured by a different company - it is once more listed on our database of medicines, marketed by Endo pharmaceuticals and manufactured with same ingredients in US...

I hope this is helpful to some of you and will also help you see whether what you have been prescribed the wrong by your GP sounds about right 

Hurdity x

[Noheroicsplease]

That's really helpful, thank you

[Lanzalover]

Many thanks for the info Hurdity.

Lanzalover x

[Daisydot]

Thank you Hurdity great info.xx

[Noheroicsplease]

Although a doctor has just told me that the testogel pump is stronger than Tostran not weaker. " It gives 16.2mg per pump rather than the 10mg per pump from the standard preparation so more concentrated to give smaller volume for men but totally unsuitable for women."

[Noheroicsplease]

Hi Hurdity,

Hope you're well.

Did you have any thoughts on what the doctor said to me about Testogel v Tostran?

[Hurdity]

Hi there - the strength of the gel is most definitely stronger with Tostran. What the consultant is talking about is the pump size and the amount of T in 1 pump. I think I explained this in my separate post?

Tostran is 2% gel
Testogel 16.2 mg is 1.62  %

Gram for gram Tostran contains more T then the Testogel.

However 1 pump of testogel gives more actual gel than Tostran hence more T in 1 pump

1 pump Tostran = 0.5 g gel - 10 mg T
1 pump Testogel 16.2 mg gives 1.25 g gel = 20.25 mg T

Tostran therefore would be easier to dispense (due to lower amount of gel and therefore T per pump), but if you wanted the weaker one then the Testogel would need to be dispnesed into a syringe as others have reported on here otherwise too much comes out at once - and yes this is comprabale to oestrogel for women where 2 pumps is the standard dose.

Testogel 1 % sachets will be available again at some point!

Hurdity x

PS I've just realised that I said exactly the same in my last post! Not sure what else you are asking? Hope I have explained OK?

[Dotty]

Thanks Hurdity. That's very useful .

I was using testogel sachets but have just been given Tostran today .

[GypsyRoseLee]

I've been using the Testogel pump pack for the last couple of weeks.

I used to make one tube of Testim last about 6-7 days using a pea sized blob. So I roughly estimated that one full pump of Testogel = 3 pea size blobs of Testim.

I've found it surprisingly simple to just slightly depress the Testogel pump to just give me a pea size blob, and it absorbs more quickly than Testim and isn't as sticky.

Bit worrying though that both my GP and pharmacist reckoned I needed two full pumps per day! Just shows you these professionals are far from infallible.

[Hurdity]

That's great GypsyRoseLee - and really helpful info

Oh dear I am dismayed to hear about Testim though - as I have now been given a whole box of this (my GP prescribed on NHS ) which will last ages. Just using up the last of my Testogel sachets - which as you say dries very quickly, and I would be very disappointed if Testim doesn't - (having also gone back to patches form a brief foray into trying Sandrena oestrogen gel which takes ages to dry!!!

That is interesting that you can pump out a tiny amount - but for those of us who use less ( eg I think I use half the amount of the Testogel  1% sachets , that you do) it might be more difficult to adjust although putting it into a syringe is an option. Too late for me now!

Yes very worrying - especially the pharmacist whose job it is to know dosage!!! Well also the GP - who must prescribe it to men and therefore must know that is the dosage for men!!!

Hurdity x

[BobbingAlong]

Thank you for this thread Hurdity. Has been v helpful as I got my first time prescription for 1% testosterone gel this week and then couldn't get it anywhere. So this info helped me decide between 2 %Tostran or testogel 1. 62 ‰(these were the only 2 options that our pharmacy could get hold of) and made for a quicker chat with gp who reissued a script for Tostran. Which I have used for first time this morning.  I'm aiming for a 5mg dose max, although I've decided for now I'm going to start a bit lower. The Tostran gel is much runnier than my oestrodose gel and so it was more of a circular patch that squirts out rather than a blob. Was easy to pump out what looked like around a third to a half of the pump compared to a full pump which I pumped and discarded just to see. Hmm, not exact, so I may try the syringe method for a more consistent dose, but by eye I am confident that I'm not pumping out more than half a pump, so am keeping below 5mg dose.  This tiny patch of gel wiped easily onto thigh/back of knee and dried very quickly.

[BobbingAlong]

Hmm, actually, the Tostran does stay a little tacky on skin after application. Yesterday I just noted "by eye" that it dried quite quickly ;I was in a hurry and just got dressed once it didn't look wet. This morning, more time and when I run my fingers lightly over where oestrogel (oestrodose I have) was applied after 5-10mins skin feels smooth and normal. Running my fingers over where Tostran was applied it is dry but feels a little "tacky"..... Still at least it's a small patch.

[Loo53]

My gynae says only use my Tostran 1 once per day is this enough? It does seem kind of watery so I pump it very gently onto the bathroom sink enamel and it comes out as a circle with half a pump I think if I depressed it any harder too much would come right out! I do recall my consultant saying some women use this 2 and 3 times a day rubbing it in their arms surely that can't be right? 

[BobbingAlong]

That does seem like far  too much, 2 or 3 pumps a day?!!  This Australian study indicictated that 5mg a day was an effective dose and upto 10mg didn't have adverse effects, but that's way less than 3 pumps of Tostran which would be 30mg.
https://www.health.harvard.edu/womens-health/study-identifies-effective-testosterone-dose-for-women.

[BobbingAlong]

... Although it's only a study of 7 women!