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[Findtyler]

Hello All

I recently started HRT after a good 10 months of feeling very unwell. Transpires I had no testosterone left. I am 46.

Symptoms included:-

Brain fog and memory loss
Chronic fatigue and lethargy
Clumsiness
Crying
Eyes - bright outside and bag under one eye, severe twitch
Hair loss
Heat - warm by day. Melting at night
Legs - restless
Motivation - lack of
Mood - despair, tearful, isolating
Nervous System - shot - wake up in the middle of the night and need to put the TV on to self soothe.
Palpitations and breathlessness
Skin - Vaginal Ezcma
Sleep pattern changed - Disturbed
Weight gain

I have been prescribed:-

0.5 ml AndroFeme1
1.0mg Sandrena gel
100mg Utrogestan

However, owing to waking up at 2.00am, 4.00am and 5.00am - 6.30am I am now taking the Utrogestan vaginally.

I am on week 5 of HRT and wonder if and when the sleep deprivation may alleviate.

And also to reach out as I feel like I am losing my mind.

[Kathleen]

Hello Findtyler and welcome to the forum.

Unfortunately I am not one of the expert ladies who can comment on the regime  you've been prescribed but I do sympathise with your plight! Many of us recognise your symptoms so you are not alone.

Hopefully someone knowledgeable will be along soon to advise you.

Take care and keep posting.

K.

[Findtyler]

Thank you Kathleen

Its the sleep deprivation thats the biggest issue at the moment.

I might try some melatonin this evening.

[Hurdity]

Hi Findtyler

  from me too.

Are you in UK or maybe seeing private menopause gynae? I ask because Androfemme is not licensed nor generally available here, but I think some women have been prescribed it privately and presumably imported from Aus?

What were your periods/cycle doing before starting the HRT? I presume you are post-menopausal because you have been given continuous progesterone ie no natural periods for 12 months or more?

Personally I would suggest that you try a cycle - most of us would not countenance taking progesterone every day (and certainly not vaginally) due to the side effects  - and disturbed sleep it can give (trips to the loo etc) so you may get relief from night sweats (from the oestrogen) but have to keep getting up to pee (due to the progesterone)!

The dose of gel is also low/medium so taking that much progesterone daily may well be far too much and explain why you haven't seen an improvement yet. Also some women do not absorb well from gel and get on better with patches (and vice versa) - so that's something else to think about further along the line maybe?

At your age if you are post-menopausal it is important to maintain your oestrogen levels for at least few more years yet so it's worth getting it right. You may well benefit also from a slightly higher dose of Sandrena - the equivalent medium dose of estrogel is two pumps which is 1.5 mg but as Sandrena is more concentrated it may be that more is absorbed of a given amount of estradiol than with the Estrogel brand?

It would be better to try to get this sorted I would have thought (ie the HRT), and try other sleep techniques ( I presume you have tried all these?) rather than take Melatonin - or rather before trying it, although I know very little about this. Another member also had a try at Melatonin (Peroxideblader) so you might have a look at her posts?

Hurdity x

[Findtyler]

Hi Hurdity

Thank you so much for your detailed and thoughtful reply.

I an in the UK. Under the care of Dr Nick Panay - who I understand is a menopause guru. Although I have to say my experience thus far is a distinct lack of bedside manner and information.

You are right Androfeme1 is not generally licenced in the UK but can be provided by way of private prescription. It's meant to be a natural testosterone - as opposed to synthetic?

Owing to my being on Cerezette my peiods are an unknown entity. I suspect I am preimenopausal, although no formal diagnosis has been received - aside from I have no testosterone. Other than that I am in good health.
 
The reason for my taking the Utrogestan vaginally is owing to the side efdects I was experiencing, which have lessend since changing the way I take it. I was waking up in an adrenaline based way and felt forever hungover.

Thank you for the heads up on cycling. This is also what the leaflet suggests but wouldn't know where to start without knowing where my cycle is.

Should I be seeing a significant improvement by week 5? I don't know what the norm is. The leaflet says 6-8 weeks. My gynie says by week 12. Frankly I'd throw myself off a ledge at that stage.

I am trying to hang in there with regard to sleep. But have a serious job which cannot see me sleep deprived.

Any feedback gratefully received.

[Hurdity]

Hi Findtyler

Well if you are seeing Nick Panay then you're in good hands and I would not presume to suggest any changes - although if you hadn't said you were seeing him I would have answered as below!

To answer your questions - all testosterone used for supplementation is "natural" including the gels - it's just that Androfeme is specifically formulated for women. As it's a cream I imagine the amount absorbed will be variable - but this will not be crucial (ie if less is absorbed) because there are no potential safety issues (as with progesterone cream which should not be used for endometrial protection).

So are you still taking Cerazette? If so then it may well be that the amount of progesterone you are taking is too high for you - but if you are still fertile then I presume it is preventing ovulation and therefore controlling your hormonal surges? I imagine that you are taking added oestrogen because Cerazette depresses this, and also the extra progesterone is to prevent endometrial stimulation from the extra oestrogen. Mini pills by themselves do not contain sufficient progestogen to protect the womb lining when oestrogen is added ( although they may do in some women for low doses of oestrogen). As this is a very specialised regime I'm sorry I can't comment further and especially as you don't know where you are in menopause.

If you are wanting contraception too then another alternative is the Mirena coil with added oestrogen ( patch or gel) but I think you could get some mood swings with that (but less extreme than without HRT) as ovulation is not always suppressed.

Not sure which leaflet you mean re improvement - the effects of testosterone - my gynae said can be up to 4-5 months - but some effects would be apparent much sooner. However I would suggest that some of your symptoms could be caused by too much progestogen being taken all the time, and maybe too little oestrogen - but as testosterone also plays a role it's impossible to say.

I hope this has given you something to think about and to ask at your next consultation but sorry I can't be of more help in your circumstances.

Hurdity x

[Findtyler]

Thank you Hurdity

Lots to think about.

I suspect my 3 month blood test results will determine hormone levels and adjustments made accordingly.

In the mean time I vacilate between the bed and the sofa.

[dazned]

It's horrible feeling like you do I so understand where you're coming from .

You are in the care of a very knowledgeable guy in this field despite you not liking his bedside/caring manner. How long before you can go back and see him so you can both maybe make some tweaks ? At least with the Androfeme you don't have to guesstimate the dosages as others do as it's specifically designed for women. There have been others on here who have used it in the past.
It's still early days yet in the brand scheme of things,though I appreciate that you want to feel better now,unfortunately it sometimes doesn't work like that. Hopefully things will improve for you .