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[Chezzy]

Saying hello!

I'm new on here so just saying hello! I'm 43 and going through early menopause. No surprise to me as my mum, aunt (identical twin sister to my mum) and grandmother both in very early 40's. May sound odd but I had assumed for a long time that was normal as had no other reference points, if that makes sense. I don't have any children, my choice, but I did let my husband know if he wanted children to let me know before it was too late.

I had my first hot flush when I was 39, though thinking back I had signs before then but hadn't put things together. Periods became more spaced apart, lighter. Then had a 3 month gap followed by one light period then stopped completely nearly 2 years ago, I did have a couple of days light bleeding followed by 2 days spotting in December so went to doctor and as it had been 20 months since last period I was sent for internal ultrasound for post menopause bleeding though appointment took two months to come through.

I'm guessing it took so long because my age, low risk and the  fact I'd had abdominal ultrasound and CT scan (for bladder/ kidney related issues a year ago for mild pain / swelling feeling in my right side, which I still have it and still undiagnosed as can't see anything wrong) anyway I had the internal scan last week, no issues, said bleed probably a last hurrah  (my words not hers)

However she also did a visual check up and said I was very dry due to low estrogen, and prescribed vagifem saying would help with pain also. I have suffered with pain during sex on and off all my life but I have to admit to finding it worse the last 3 or 4 years and I find any excuse to avoid as now as have no desire either! So really hoping this will help, only three days in so time will tell.

I got the usual 'you are young for menopause' line, which sometimes comes across as though they don't believe me, and I have to explain family history, but on this occasion it sounded like concern, she asked if I was on HRT, which I said no, I'd not really contemplated it, if I had any symptoms that bothered me, hot flushes, night sweats etc (I've had hot flushes and night sweats on and off. At the moment more on than off!) and if any osteoporosis in family (both parents, mum in her mid fifties and dad after hip fracture in his eighties) She suggested I might want to think about about HRT and have a chat with my doctor, and also about osteoporosis prevention due to early menopause.

Which has led me to this website which I have found very useful so far and I think I will make appointment with doctor.
I've told two doctors that I was going through menopause, first was when I was peri, and second when I was post menopause and neither mentioned options of HRT, if I had any symptoms that bothered me, or if family history of osteoporosis, just 'ok' when explained  mum was also same age. (One specialise s in women's issues! ) Any advice on what I need to ask my doctor about / mention with regards HRT and also osteoporosis prevention when I go would be appreciated as I'm not very good at talking to doctors so thinking of taking list of questions with me.

[CLKD]

   meet your GP with "I know it's thought that (age) is too young to go into menopause, however .... " and taking a list of symptoms might be useful.  Decide which symptom is currently the most bothersome so that you have something to discuss with your Practice Nurse/GP.  Keeping a mood/food/symptom diary might be useful.

Have you looked at the Daisy web-site ? as well as the Osteoporosis web-site?

Browse round.  Use the 'search' button if it helps.  Are you using the Vagifem often enough?

As oestrogen levels drop off the body becomes dry: nostrils, deep in the ears, skin, vagina, eyes  as well as muscles might become lax = aches and pains.  "the change" 

[Chezzy]

Thanks for tips, that sounds a good way to get the conversation started with my doctor.

I've had a quick look at the daisy network, I will also have a look at the osteoporosis one.

I've only just started vagifem so I'm on daily for two weeks then twice a week indefinitely.

[Taz2]

Hi Chezzy.

You will feel much better now that you have found this site. Looking forward to learning more about you.

Taz x 

[Dancinggirl]

Hi Chezzy
I went through early meno - was peri from mid 30s and post meno by 42.  That doctor was right to be concerned about you not being on HRT. I would strongly recommend you use HRT until you are at least 52-53 to protect your heart and bones - particularly if osteoporosis is in the family.  Non HRT treatments for osteoporosis can have nasty side effects and HRT at your age should be the front line treatment to prevent osteoporosis - it would be the best protection for your bones and would benefit your heart, bladder, VA, flushes etc as well.
Do read up all the info on this site to get clued up and just try HRT - I would start with a sequential HRT which will bring a monthly bleed but this is best until well into post meno.  I would suggest you try something like Femoston 1/10 first as the progesterone in this one is kinder and brings fewer side effects.  It can take time to get use to HRT - there are often some side effects  to start with and it can be a bit of trial and error till you find the one that suits you, however you may be very surprised at how good you feel after the first 3-6 months.
When you go for your appointment - write down all your symptoms and questions, possibly print out the list of TREATMENTS that are at the top of this page.  Considering your family history, I would also ask for a bone scan to see how your bones are right now.
You might want to read through the NHS NICE guidelines on the treatment of meno symptoms as well - they should be somewhere on this site. Keep us posted.  DG x

[Chezzy]

Thanks everyone for the welcome 

There is so much information on here which is great, though might take a while to read through it all. Its already explained why I've started getting spots the last couple of years, thought I'd left them behind in my teens   

Thanks DG it's good to hear from someone who went through it at the same age, do you mind me asking when you started HRT?

I don't have anyone really to talk to, so it's been quite a lonely journey so far.

I know my mum wasn't on HRT, all I remember was her saying was she had a short period of mood swings at the start and she suffered with dry eyes and later osteoporosis, I'm sure there was more that she didn't talk about.

I'm going to ring doctors on Monday to make an appointment, waiting time for appointments is normally about a week here, maybe less, so I will get reading!

I'm normally fairly tolerant to things so I'm crossing my fingers if he prescribes HRT I don't have too many issues, but who knows! Out of curiosity I thought I'd look up which progesterone I was taking when used to be on the pill, stopped about 9 years ago (levonorgestrel) which I had no issues with, not sure if that is relevant or useful information.

 

[Dancinggirl]

Hi Chezzy.  I actually started to have problems soon after I had my son at the age of 33 - my periods simply didn't settle down.   I started to get long or very short gaps between periods or my periods seemed to go on for a long time - I got flushes, aching legs and awful headaches that lasted for days. In hindsight I now realise I was fortunate to have a good GP at the time - she was an older lady who had started out in gynae/obstetrics so a bit more clued up than most. She referred me for a D&C and investigations after which my periods stopped altogether and at the follow up appointment at the hospital they looked at the bloods they had done and simply told me I was in premature ovarian failure and I was lucky I'd had my 2 children.  I resisted HRT, was worried about using hormones, tried various alternative remedies and even paid a fortune for chinese herbal stuff - though my periods returned they were erratic and I now realise this is typical of the peri meno phase giving the false impression that these remedies were working.

At 37, I eventually went back to my good GP to discuss things further - she was horrified that I had used the chinese medicine, apparently some of these things can be highly toxic - beware of alternative medicine!!! Anyway, she simply said “if I was her daughter she would insist I take HRT”. She also sent me for a DEXA scan which showed some bone loss. I had young children and I needed to work and be a proper mother. 

Then started the challenge of finding the right HRT.  I tried a variety of standard options in the first 2-3 years - most of which gave some side effects I found difficult.  I then paid to go to a private meno clinic in London - the Amarant Centre - where they did a full reassessment and put me on Oestrogel (one pump per day) with progesterone in pill form (Dydrogesterone) for 10 days search month. After the 10 days of progesterone I got 3-4 days of light bleeding, so this was a typical sequential regime popular in France but not usually prescribed on the NHS at that time (mid 1990s).  I knew I had gone into post meno after a couple more years (aged 42) as I started to get urogenital atrophy problems and some flushes, so increased my Oestrogel to 2 pumps per day.

It's good that you have identified a progesterone you did OK with before, however, our bodies do change when meno hits and HRT ideally should mirror, as closely as possible, the hormones that our bodies are missing.  This is why I suggested Femoston.
You do have the option of having a Mirena fitted (I believe this has levonorgestrel in it)  and this usually means there will be little if any bleeding and you simply add in oestrogen as either pills, patch or Oestrogel alongside - this can be a good hassle free option.
Here are your options for combined pills and patches:
http://www.menopausematters.co.uk/perimeno.php

I would suggest you start on a low dose and only increase if necessary.

Here is the info about the Mirena option:

Mirena is a levonorgestrel (type of progestogen) releasing system which sits inside the womb, gradually releasing the progestogen into the womb. It is licensed in the UK and Ireland as a contraceptive agent, for treatment of heavy periods and, from August 2004, also for the progestogen component of HRT. It can be used in both the perimenopause and postmenopause and it is particularly useful for:

Persistent progestogenic side effects from systemic HRT despite changes in type and route of progestogen.
When contraception is required along with HRT in the perimenopause.
When withdrawal bleeds on sequential HRT are heavy, after investigation if indicated. (see WHEN TO BE REFERRED )
With Mirena in place, systemic estrogen alone can be taken as the Mirena provides adequate protection of the womb lining and the estrogen dose and route can be tailored to meet the individual's needs.

Progestogenic absorption throughout the body is minimal so reducing progestogenic side effects. The effect of Mirena on the womb lining can significantly reduce bleeding and when used as part of an HRT regimen, in time, 30 to 60% of women have no bleeding at all. Although Mirena used for contraception is licensed for 5 years, the license for use for the progestogen part of HRT is currently 4 years.
Price: £88.00

You could also try the option I used in my 40s  - so ask for oestrogen as Oestrogel or Patch and then take progesterone in pill form (either Provera or Utrogestan) for 10-12 days each month.

My best advice for you would be:  keep it simple at this stage - don't listen to horror stories about bad side effects or progesterone intolerance as we are all different and what works for one women won't worked for another - try the Femoston 1/10 as it may well be really good for you and then experiment later if need be.
We are here to support you, so keep us posted and we'll help if needed. 
Good luck  Dg xxxxx

 

[Barney]

I am 61 years old and for the last 7 years have been suffering from what ever you want to call it menopause ,change of life whatever the buzz word is for the day it has been hell What I don't quite understand is that we can put men on the moon but come to helping ladies go through the menopause well that's another story I have tried all different Hrts and even testosterone implantsto eventually find out after 3 years that dreadful depression and aniexty and bleeding I was severely progesterone intolerant This only came to light after I had the Mirena coil put in and 10 days later had  to be admitted to the local AE department because I was so ill. Thinking I was clever had paid a privately to see supposedly a specialist gynaecologist who specialised in the menopause. He obviously did not know what he was doing and having cost me £5000 later decided that I would need to try and sort myself out.I have read every book I can find about how to cope with the menopause trying every type of herbal tablets on the market acupuncture and found nothing to work.I  have been on antidepression tablets beta blockers but still the symptoms went on I am now 7 years later slowly but gradually coming to the end What annoys me most about my waste of 7 years is that when you talk to any health professional all I ever get Oh those are not menopause symptoms so off I go for another blood test and guess
what they come back as normal.I am fortunate enough to have a wonderful husband and daughter who without the support they have given me I am not quite sure we're I would be today.The menopause is no joke and society needs to start and make allowance for us ladies as we approach this time in our lives.Fortunately for a few ladies they don't seem to suffer but oh boy don't they make you feel a fraud.I have been told by my endrocologist that I am at the top end of the spectrum as far as symptoms of the menopause He was the only person who actually sat me down and said yes it will get better and explained how it would fade out.To every lady who like me has had a torrid time you will get better everybody's symptoms are different and in the end you must do what is right for you.Be it hrt antidepressants beta blockers bottles of wine long walks or in my case sleeping tablets.Many days it's been a case of let's start again tomorrow by putting myself to sleep and waking up the next day and trying to move forward.All I hope from this forum is that when my daughter reaches her menopause that she does not have to suffer the pain and anguish that I have been through in the last 7 years.

[samweller161]

Wow Barney, that was a great post!  Agreed, lots of ladies sail through it but for a lot of us, its like the world is caving in.  I particularly liked your analogy regarding men on the moon, you are so right!  Its really horrible at times although I can have a few good days which the seem to fall into a few horrendous days.  Am trying to keep a mood/food/where I am in my cycle diary to see if there is a pattern.  But girl power to all ladies who are going through it, at least we are not alone !!

SP x

[Kathleen]

Hello Chezzy and welcome to the forum.

As you can see you have come to the right place for help and support from women who have shared your experiences.

Barney -  I am sixty and entering my seventh year without a period. I can safely say that I have felt cr@p in one way or another since then!  My GP is a young man who is fortunately knowledgeable, sympathetic and helpful but nothing I have taken, including HRT  has eradicated my flushes and anxiety. I even saw a gynecologist privately who didn't seem familiar with any of the emotional symptoms of the menopause. Perhaps we should all be talking to endocrinologists instead, we are dealing with hormones after all!

I agree with you that science seems capable of spectacular achievements but when it comes to something that could help fifty per cent of the population knowledge seems fairly basic. Perhaps there's too little money to be made or they are just not interested.

I was heartened to hear that  problems do fade eventually, I suppose I must just try not to have a nervous breakdown before that glorious day dawns!

Take care ladies.

K.

[Barney]

Wow Barney, that was a great post!  Agreed, lots of ladies sail through it but for a lot of us, its like the world is caving in.  I particularly liked your analogy regarding men on the moon, you are so right!  Its really horrible at times although I can have a few good days which the seem to fall into a few horrendous days.  Am trying to keep a mood/food/where I am in my cycle diary to see if there is a pattern.  But girl power to all ladies who are going through it, at least we are not alone !!

SP x

[Hurdity]

Hi Chezzy

  from me too.

I agree with the others - you should start HRT and continue until at least 51/52 - average age of menopause.

Kathleen - if your HRT has not eliminated flushes then you need a higher dose of oestrogen. I started in 50 mcg patch in very late perimenopause at about 54 and they disappeared within days/weeks never to return except when I tried stopping or reducing oestrogen dose. I have almost always only ever taken it cyclically though. Some women find that during the progestogen phase flushes return because it interferes with the beneficial effect of oestrogen on reducing vasomotor symptoms. Anxiety can be caused by low oestrogen and also some of the synthetic progestogens (if life's stresses are not to blame). Maybe time to change your HRT?

Barney - sorry to hear about your long term menopausal problems - what a pity you did not find an HRT type/dose to suit you. This should be possible for all women and doctors/gynaecologists should not fob us off by saying blood tests are normal! Low oestrogen/testosterone is "normal" for women after menopause and as they age, but doesn't make it OK!!

Hurdity x

[Kathleen]

Hello Hurdity.

Thank you for your comment about my HRT. I did increase my patch from 50 mcg to 75 mcg but had to stop due to bleeding. I haven't checked my diary for that time but I'm pretty sure the flushes continued as well. Also I saw a gynecologist privately and my oestrogen levels were 90 something which was thought to be a bit low and the Consultant concluded that I wasn't absorbing the hormones properly ( I see that another lady on the forum is getting nearly 300 something from a 50 mcg patch ). I am thinking of asking to try Tibolone but if that doesn't eradicate the flushing I don't know what I'll do. Needless to say I am following the thread on Tibolone very carefully! In many respects my menopause hasn't been too troublesome, I have so far escaped muscles pains, urinary problems, drenching sweats and severe insomnia but I still have daily flushing, palpitations, anxiety and sometimes strong panicky surges. After nearly seven years of this, three without HRT and four with, I am heartily sick of it all. Once again I am grateful for your response and if you have any suggestions I would be very interested to hear them.

Take care.

K.

[Barney]

Hurdity,
I am interested to know how if you are severely progesterone intolerant how I could stay on hrt. I had tried every tablet,patch and gel that was available and non worked.My only way forward which was suggested by the gynaecologist was that I took the estrogen without the progesterone part of the tablet.I still have a womb so I was upping my odds by 14 percent in getting womb cancer. I thought the risk was too high.It also involved me having to have an intensive smear every six months which in itself was going to up my anxiety to a level that I thought would not help my mental health.The only way forward I can see would have been for me to have a hysterectomy.How was I going to persuade a NHS doctor that this was a good way forward.The only way I could see was for me to pay to have the hysterectomy and having finished up in AE once felt rather reluctant to go down this line again Any thoughts I am interested to hear.

[CLKD]

I haven't heard that ladies require a 6-montly smear test, some need regular investigations to check on the thickness inside the womb, someone will be along I'm sure ......