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[Niamh]

Hi ladies

So for those of you who are intolerant to progesterone and on utro, when do you find you feel 'normal' after stopping your utro phase? I use 100mg vaginally for 7 days each month, I'm now 7 days post stopping this month and period has been and almost gone yet I still feel rubbish better than I did but not right! I feel like I can't get it out of my system this month, does anyone else get this? Thank you

[Dmt]

I'm taking exactly the same, but this is only my 2nd month and I am 3 days in on the 7 day cycle. Starting to get a bit tetchy with everyone at the moment, but not nearly as bad as I did on the synthetic made progesterone. Last month, I would say I felt less PMS after about 2 to 3 days after stopping Utrogestan 100, but that said, I haven't felt completely normal for at least 2 years so my BHRT is still very much a work in progress.

[Hurdity]

Niamh - if your mood still hasn't improved all the while until you need to start the utro again then maybe you do need that little bit extra oestrogen as Studd has suggested (maybe try half a pump if this is possible?)? Maybe it is not the progesterone after all  . Having said that though, when I go to a shorter cycle I find that the prog affects me more (adversely) than when I am on a longer cycle - but this is while I am actually taking it.

Hurdity x

[Frankie41]

Hi again Niamh,

Yes I've experienced exactly what you're going through - it probably took me about 10 days to 2 weeks post stopping the progesterone until I felt better.    I haven't had it since! - 3 months!  I had a scan after that experience and apparently my uterus lining was very thin (good) - so on that basis, my endo said I could do long-cycle progesterone therapy.  But time is up and will be talking to endo this week about what next - eek!   I am interested in exploring the possibility of having my uterus removed to avoid the progesterone but this is obviously fairly radical and I'll have to weigh the risks/benefits of surgery - I understand when removing the uterus there is a risk of severing the blood supply to ovaries, so they could "dissolve"/stop working.  Although I sometimes think that would be ok since my ovarian cycle sends me loopy anyway (which is why I have it suppressed with Lucrin), I know surgical menopause is a whole new level of hard.    As Hurdity said, maybe upping your dose of oestrogen will help.  Because you are not producing any of your own, this would argue for a higher dose than women whose own cycle is not suppressed.  Also, being on the small side, you won't be storing much (as you probably know, E is stored in fat).        I will probably have to try a Mirena before surgery, a bit reluctant, but probably wise.   Good luck and I hope you feel better soon.

[Niamh]

Hello again we sound very similar! I see Studd (think I mentioned on the other post you replied) you sound severely intolerant like me fun isn't it 🙈🙈Studd has allowed me to skip my Feb dose so I don't this again until March now and has advised I have a full hyster ovaries included so I can just have ostrogen only and never face progesterone again my GP is in agreement and is referring me. I see no other long term option ...years of hell on progesterone and potentially thickening etc no thanks! I think like you it thoroughly poisons me, I feel much better this evening and truly believe this is the progesterone doing it to me. I felt fine 2 weeks ago until the damn stuff so I don't think it's my ostrogen levels BUT if I still feel like this in another week I will try 3 pumps but that didn't agree with me last time. Do keep in touch I hope you find a way forward oh btw mirena was awful for me I lasted 48 hours but you may be ok I don't want to scare you but I just can't do progesterone at all it seems, Provera sent me insane too and so sick I couldn't move I lasted 48 hours on that hence hyster for me!x

[Niamh]

Btw my own cycle is only suppressed by the ostrogel/utro combo I know this doesn't work for many but Studd has definitely suppressed it, I've not had my own period or cycle since on it although the first 6 months were rocky. I saw him for pms so it's great I don't get my own pms but you can't avoid the reaction to progesterone as you know if you still have a uterus!

[Frankie41]

wow interesting.    Did you always have PMS or did it arise in peri?  I don't think I had true PMS until peri - and then it became more like PMDD - (funny how we adopt these labels but they are helpful to convey where we are on the spectrum!).    My endo so far has not been keen on that idea for me but I think we'll be putting all ideas on the table in the next consult.  It's also really interesting you've been able to suppress your cycle with that combo.  Even on lucrin, I can feel my cycle break through to some extent (although symptoms are much less).   And yeah it's interesting you don't feel that great when you go higher on oestrogel - I wonder whether that's because the extra oestrogen is "awakening" your progesterone receptors (apparently happens) or is true excess for you.  I wonder what Studd would think - I've read he thinks sometimes you just need to feel worse on a higher E dose before you feel better.    Like you, I've previously felt bad on a higher dose (so have reverted to lower dose) even though on the the lower dose I've still had fatigue, brain fog and sometimes low mood.     Arggh!  As you can tell I like to have an explanation for everything!  But is sometimes impossible.    Best of luck with your referral!! 

[Niamh]

My pms kicked off post my first boy so I was early 30s, it then was horrific post 2nd boy (late 30s), I also had pnd post my 2nd and therefore follow Studds text book prog intolerant lady! I think he's suppressed it as I was v v early peri if peri at all so don't know how mad my own hormones were really. I saw him for pms and my sister who is now 48 is only just hitting peri, my mum went through meno about 52 so I think really I just had dreadful pms and pnd and it was only going to get worse anyway. I started on 3 pumps but after about 2 months I just felt I was on the ceiling with anxiety, wired etc it was very different to my prog reaction. I feel fine on 2 and guess what today I'm back to normal so it took 7 days to come down fully off the utro! Oh yes I like an answer I get that too😂I have to know or I drive myself mad!!xx

[Frankie41]

Huh, interesting.  It all kicked off for me too following weaning second boy (late thirties).  I had no history of PMS until then also no PND although had a couple episodes clinical depression - first not long after "menarche" when I first got my period and then early twenties.  There were other stressors involved of course but I always felt there was a hormonal component because the stressor always outweighed the magnitude of my symptoms.   Well the good news for you is that hopefully you won't have to deal with peri at all!   Great news you are back to normal after utro.  I have also become Jekel this week after Hyde emerged last week following some break through of luteal phase (bloods registered progesterone whereas it's normally not detectable at all).  So bona fide proof progesterone induces madness!   

[Niamh]

Hi again I have sent you a PM x

[Hurdity]

My pms kicked off post my first boy so I was early 30s, it then was horrific post 2nd boy (late 30s), I also had pnd post my 2nd and therefore follow Studds text book prog intolerant lady!

I thought PND was down to low oestrogen which is why Studd treats with oestrogen? Oestrogen crashes and progesterone also does so (to normal low levels)  following childbirth so PND would not indicate progesterone intolerance surely

http://www.studd.co.uk/postnataldepression.php
http://www.studd.co.uk/postnataldepression-oct2016.php
http://www.studd.co.uk/depression_pn.php

Be that as it may - I hope you get your levels sorted Niamh! 

Hurdity x

[sophmcc]

Hi Niamh,  I am new to this forum, I came across it as I was googling "Utrogestan side effects". I am very similar to you - 45 years old struggling with PMS and went see Studd in November.  I had six weeks of Oestrogel and have felt amazing telling anyone who would listen I was cured.  I finished my first 7 day Utro cycle and 4 days later felt terrible: moody, irrational, anxious etc which then cleared after about 4 days.  I am so disappointed as I thought all was so good!! I'm dreading starting it again on 1st Feb already.  I see Studd on 8th Feb- I'm wondering if I have to take it every month?  It's all so confusing!!!  I thought I might email him in the meantime - have you done that?  Sorry for all the questions!!

Sophie

[Hurdity]

Hi sophmcc

 

I am sure Niamh will be along to answer soon!

If you are taking oestrogen for pms then this is different from those of us who are menopausal. Normally yes progesterone should be taken every month but I think Studd's short cycle of prog is often OK for women in your position because if you are ovulating regularly then you will producing a large amount of progesterone yourself which presumably clears the lining. I also know ( from reading on here) that one woman at least, in your position (ie regular periods, terrible mood swings, and not yet peri-menopausal) was permitted not to take progesterone every month for this reason. If you are Studd's pateint then presumably you would have regular scans anyway - although perhaps these aren't needed when taking HRT during the reproductive years ie before peri-menopause.

Hurdity x

[sophmcc]

Thank you Hurdity 
I'm so new to all this I'm not fully across anything _ I had no idea about needing scans etc till I started reading this forum.  I have a long list of questions for him on the 8th Feb that's for sure!