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[GypsyRoseLee]

Hi kiltgirl.

If I were you, I would get the Mirena removed asap and see how you feel. I am very sensitive to progesterone (most women who suffer with PMS are) and when I tried the Mirena it gave me much worse PMS, and I had it ALL month.

Just because the progesterone in the Mirena is released locally, it doesn't mean it STAYS locally. It can, and does, travel around your system and it can cause dreadful symptoms in some women.

Prof Studd mentions on his website that in some women the Mirena can exacerbate their PMS, and he doesn't recommend it.

I am one of his patients (my PMS has been getting steadily worse, until it became PMDD, and then got even worse in peri Menopause), and one of the first things he checked was if I had the Mirena, because if I had, he would have wanted to remove it there and then.

I am currently on a combination of 4 pumps oestrogel + testim gel + 100mg Sertraline and it is certainly helping - but my PMS still comes back every month. It is dreadful. I am crippled with anxiety and have felt suicidal at times. The depression is soul destroying. Then it suddenly all disappears as quickly as it came.

Prof Studd has written to my GP recommending I try a course of Zoladex injections + add back Livial. And I'm just summoning the courage to try it.

[kiltgirl]

I've got 3 tats, 2 are cover ups so I guess I've been inked 5 times. But they're cover uppable for Work etc. I'd love one at the nape of my neck to symbolise my 3 kids and angel baby

They're only exposed really on holiday

X

Ah that's perfect, what a lovely idea 

I'm kinda glad I'm too skint for more right now I think it could be addictive! Angel baby...I'm so sorry  A tattoo is a lovely idea, never forgotten x

Aw that's ok. She would be 27 just after Christmas
I've often thought 3 open flowers and the 4th a flower bud  in 2 pinks for the girls and 2 blues for the boys

X

[Tempest]

Yes, fluctuations are a killer for sure! I had enough of those during peri too.

So far, I've tried Estrogel (twice), Premarin and now Estradot patches.

I USED to think the gel wasnt very consistent - until I tried the patches and I have found these much worse for me! I have problems the day 1 of a new patch as it doesn't seem to 'catch up' when I remove the old one until day 2. Day 2 is fairly even, and then it trails off again at the end of day 3. I certainly can't go 3 1/2 days on a patch! I've been on these 2 months in total (over a month at 50 mcg) and I thought it should have evened out at least a bit by now! My levels feel very low on this dose compared to the 2 1\2 pumps of Estrogel I was using (50mcg is supposed to be roughly the same as 2 pumps of gel).

I've also had problems raising my dose higher to achieve good levels whilst on anything, but I think this is due to having gone so long previously without any HRT. I've been offered an implant in January, but am very scared to go ahead with it as it cannot be removed once placed (and they last 4 - 6 months)! Given my problems, I would rather wait a while to get a rough idea of what level I feel ok at first (if I ever get there).!

I think I asked before if you're in Scotland? Sorry if you've replied before, but I can't keep track of where I posted (meno. brain)! If you are, then implants will be available to you of both estrogen and testosterone if you are comfortable with these. They are supposed to be the 'gold standard' of HRT for younger oopherectomised women - I know Professor Studd has written about this being the case too.

[kiltgirl]

I had a subtotal hysterectomy 13 years ago.  Initially the surgeon wanted to whip everything out - i.e. womb, cervix and ovaries - but after lengthy discussion agreed to do the subtotal, provided that they looked healthy.

I said to him how many men would have their testicles removed just because there was a chance they could become troublesome at some point down the line and he totally agreed

As far as I am aware, ovaries do still produce small amounts of oestrogen even in post menopausal women.

You're quite right...I really want the moodiness to stop though...maybe it's a lobotomy I need instead 

Did you feel OK after your hysterectomy?

Oh I don't know...I do want to keep my cervix though...I need to talk it all through with my gynae

[GypsyRoseLee]

Hi Tempest

You say you feel bad on the day you change your patch, as it needs to 'catch up'. Have you tried keeping the old patch + the new patch, on together for say 12 hours, before removing the old patch?

It might help with the 'transfer'.

[kiltgirl]

loving the chats about tats and mini skirts, think we all got to that age. I haven't got one (yet)!!  Annie - that is so sweet about the flowers and a bud, a lovely idea.

Now down to more serious matters......Kiltgirl - it sounds like you have a good gynae which helps enormously.  My surgeon was very anti HRT and then very reluctantly put me on tablets after it was obvious that I had had a hormone crash! But, he did not want to know when I then had problems with the tablets. It was thanks to this site, that I went privately to a consultant that I found about on here who was very knowledgeable about HRT and who recommended  transdermal, as its a constant dose (alongside Utrogestan as I still have my uterus).  It took a few weeks to settle after the switch in dosage forms, but now normality is resumed, including visits to the gym!

Coldethyl- really sorry to hear of your experience and so glad that all seems to be settling now. Ovarian cancer is not easily detected is it.
Rhiner

I will definitely be pushing for transdermal, don't feel like putting a strain on my liver etc if I can avoid it.

Sorry your GP wasn't interested in finding something that actually worked for you...I wonder if it dents their egos when the thing they prescribe doesn't work!

[kiltgirl]

Hi kiltgirl.

If I were you, I would get the Mirena removed asap and see how you feel. I am very sensitive to progesterone (most women who suffer with PMS are) and when I tried the Mirena it gave me much worse PMS, and I had it ALL month.

Just because the progesterone in the Mirena is released locally, it doesn't mean it STAYS locally. It can, and does, travel around your system and it can cause dreadful symptoms in some women.

Prof Studd mentions on his website that in some women the Mirena can exacerbate their PMS, and he doesn't recommend it.

I am one of his patients (my PMS has been getting steadily worse, until it became PMDD, and then got even worse in peri Menopause), and one of the first things he checked was if I had the Mirena, because if I had, he would have wanted to remove it there and then.

I am currently on a combination of 4 pumps oestrogel + testim gel + 100mg Sertraline and it is certainly helping - but my PMS still comes back every month. It is dreadful. I am crippled with anxiety and have felt suicidal at times. The depression is soul destroying. Then it suddenly all disappears as quickly as it came.

Prof Studd has written to my GP recommending I try a course of Zoladex injections + add back Livial. And I'm just summoning the courage to try it.

Hi GypsyRoseLee,

I had it removed a month ago, still recovering!

Never again...and why are GPs always so surprised that we might link the way we feel to the Mirena!!? I mean...please don't tell me they haven't heard it before?

Your symptoms sound awful, do you think you will give the new treatments a try? The suicidal feeling is awful...I try to stand beside it, remember it isn't really me but my hormones. Is good you have the advice of a meno expert, I hate the thought of going to my GP and getting flustered while they deny that anxiety could be hormone based...I mean...WHAT!!??

[Tempest]

Thanks, GRL! Yep, that's the next plan!! Might go for keeping it on for 4 hours initially, as I've seen talked about over at Hystersisters.

Oh crikey - I'm gonna end up like the lady I read about that Professor Studd talked about in the DM in total desperation, I know it! She had 17 - yes SEVENTEEN patches on when he saw her! Her levels were astronomical, and she STILL didn't feel good (but no wonder, though)!!

Tattoos? (You're a wee soul, Annie)! Mini skirts?!? Well, I have ONE tattoo, very small and I'm not sure that it's even in the same place now as when I had it done in my 20's. Lol! I haven't seen my legs for YEARS (well that's a lie - but no one else has)! I'm strictly a leggings/jeans/trousers girl. It's too flippin' cold up here in Scotland (how the hell kilts are the national dress, I'll never know)!

[kiltgirl]

Yes, fluctuations are a killer for sure! I had enough of those during peri too.

So far, I've tried Estrogel (twice), Premarin and now Estradot patches.

I USED to think the gel wasnt very consistent - until I tried the patches and I have found these much worse for me! I have problems the day 1 of a new patch as it doesn't seem to 'catch up' when I remove the old one until day 2. Day 2 is fairly even, and then it trails off again at the end of day 3. I certainly can't go 3 1/2 days on a patch! I've been on these 2 months in total (over a month at 50 mcg) and I thought it should have evened out at least a bit by now! My levels feel very low on this dose compared to the 2 1\2 pumps of Estrogel I was using (50mcg is supposed to be roughly the same as 2 pumps of gel).

I've also had problems raising my dose higher to achieve good levels whilst on anything, but I think this is due to having gone so long previously without any HRT. I've been offered an implant in January, but am very scared to go ahead with it as it cannot be removed once placed (and they last 4 - 6 months)! Given my problems, I would rather wait a while to get a rough idea of what level I feel ok at first (if I ever get there).!

I think I asked before if you're in Scotland? Sorry if you've replied before, but I can't keep track of where I posted (meno. brain)! If you are, then implants will be available to you of both estrogen and testosterone if you are comfortable with these. They are supposed to be the 'gold standard' of HRT for younger oopherectomised women - I know Professor Studd has written about this being the case too.

Hi...I agree the implant is a scary thought, given how reluctant they can be to remove it when you don't feel it's right!

I am originally Scottish, moved down to England when I was 20...thought I was all grown up then...sigh

Seems so unfair that the quality of our lives can be dictated by postcode funding etc...I for one would never be able to afford any kind of private treatment...so I guess we are at the mercy of the great British GP...

I will make sure I tell my gynae I want consistency...just as long as it's not consistently cr@p!

[Tempest]

You got it, Kiltgirl! Consistently crap is awful.

Unfortunately, all HRT takes a while to stabilise in any case, but you can get a 'feel' for if it's going in the right direction after 6 weeks according to my Consultant.

The postcode lottery is a disgrace! Implants are also available in London - this shouldn't be the case and they should be consistently available across the board in the NHS to all oopherectomised younger women. We are unique in Scotland as we have control of our own NHS, as you probably know. Some of this is good, some bad. We don't have quite as many freedoms about being treated outwith of our health boards up here, which means that in some areas women have no access to menopause services at all! The odd patient has been referred to NHS Greater Glasgow & Clyde for implants, and they do them up at Grey's Hospital too. So it's not consistent by any means here either.

[Annie0710]

Oh Tempest I really love it when you pop in.  I know your posts are serious and you know I'm rooting for you but I'm picturing you with umpteen estradots all over you!
That's what I love about you, although you have and are suffering far worse than the majority of us you still manage to put humour into your posts and can laugh about you!

You're a legend on here 😘

X


Forgot to add that the tat on my boob started off on my neck 

[Tempest]

Aww, shucks! Thanks, Annie.

I'd love one day to be legendary for riding off into the distance and finally giving menopause the finger. Now THAT would be an epic ending!

P.S......mine is now on the sole of my foot. Not going to even MENTION where it started out.......

 

[sweettooth]

Hi ladies
I'm too extremely sensitive to hormones.  Had to have mirena removed as it left me sooo down!  On ovary removal I can only tell you my experience but yours could be different.

I had my womb removed age 46 due to prolapse I was already on hrt because of peri.  This made hormones even more unbalanced...dreadful.  Anyway I went to prof studd and got the usual 4 pumps est gel bear in mind I was already on a 100mg patch.  No better so to cut long story short I opted to have ovaries removed whilst still using 4 pumps est gel the idea being that fluctuations would stop and the estrogen would be then beneficial without interruptions.   Afterwards I had a very slight improvement in daily headaches and nausea.  My mood was still up and down still flushing still quite a lot of debilitating headaches. 

I am now 55 and had estrogen & prog sensitive breast cancer in 2014 so had to stop estrogen! and take a hormone blocker, well the tears come and go, I sweat, have flushes, Im fatigued exhausted, anxious, flat no motivation had to give up work as could not cope.  Sometimes I feel ok then it all starts again like I am still having cycles!!! Why?

Getting back to your dilemma of having ovaries removed or not all I can do is give you my experience.... it did not help me....but you could be different and I really hope you are.

Thinking of you all and wishing you the very best for good outcomes.

S tooth x

[Melbury]

I had a subtotal hysterectomy 13 years ago.  Initially the surgeon wanted to whip everything out - i.e. womb, cervix and ovaries - but after lengthy discussion agreed to do the subtotal, provided that they looked healthy.

I said to him how many men would have their testicles removed just because there was a chance they could become troublesome at some point down the line and he totally agreed

As far as I am aware, ovaries do still produce small amounts of oestrogen even in post menopausal women.

You're quite right...I really want the moodiness to stop though...maybe it's a lobotomy I need instead 

Did you feel OK after your hysterectomy?

Oh I don't know...I do want to keep my cervix though...I need to talk it all through with my gynae

Yes I was fine after, just wish I had had it done a lot sooner instead of having three years of nightmare periods which were extremely difficult to cope with (such heavy bleeding) and very painful.  I had a melon sized fibroid that was causing the problems.

I definitely think you should have a good talk to your gynae about which bits to keep. 

[Tempest]

Hi, Sweettooth!

I'm so sorry you're going through all this - it's incredibly tough for sure!

I can categorically confirm that YES, the symptoms DO go in cycles when you've had your ovaries removed in my experience. It certainly hasn't helped me mood wise either. I wish we knew why this is happening!

Sending you biggest hugs, you're a very brave lady. xxxx