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[Ljp]

Hi, I've been on mirena, estring and oestrogel 1.5 pumps since last December, and used estriol cream alone from a May last year until December.

Apart from hot flushes, horrendous anxiety and feeling depressed and brain fog, my worst symptom was overactive bladder. It has been much better generally, but I still get days, when for no obvious reason I have to rush to loo lots, today has been awful, I teach a dance class fir two hours on a Monday, and I e had to visit the ladies to pee FIVE times, it's horrible, comes on suddenly and urgently, horrible dull ache in bladder.
Urine is clear, I have no cystitis symptoms.
I can have days like this, yet other days it will be pretty normal, and bearable.

I try removing estring, in case it's pressing on urethra/bladder, but not sure it's made any significant improvement.
I tried upping oestrogel to two pumps, and think that did start to help, but I also ended up getting mouth ulcers,mand athletes foot, all things I used to get near my periods prior to menopause, no thrush though, thank goodness, as that was another recurrent problem in my pre meno days. So dropped down to 1.5 pumps again

Just wondering if anyone else has similar? And if anything has helped?

It gets me down, it's embarks sing and can be a nightmare on a journey or out shopping if it's having a bad day

[Dancinggirl]

I have had this problem for many years - I'm afraid this is simply something that some of suffer us with.  I can sometimes pee 3-4 times a night and sometimes get up only once - often regardless of what I have eaten or how much I've drunk. During the day I sometimes need to pee often and then sometimes I can go 4-6 hours between pees!!!! It is advisable to avoid caffeine and too much alcohol as these have a diuretic effect.  I do think drinking small amounts of water throughout the day is sensible and even if you feel you need to pee try hanging on for a bit - the bladder can shrink if not allowed to hold a good enough amount of urine before emptying. Also, very important, do make sure you properly empty your bladder when you do go, so really relax and sit there for some time and perhaps tilt the hips back and forth to allow it all to come out - I think it gets harder to properly empty the bladder as we age as the urethra becomes squashed - gravity does terrible things to our bodies.  Dg x

[CLKD]

Are you drinking enough?  I think there is a way of controlling an 'over-active' bladder which needs correct diagnosis. 

I find that using Ovestin aggravates mine the following day then symptoms settle again.  If the estring is delivering daily maybe it's too much?

[Ljp]

I do drink enough, maybe an odd day when I don't. I teach dance fitness classes too and drink at least l-1.5 letters of water during a class.
I'm not big on caffeine, although I do enjoy a nice cup of Coffee as a treat but that's not daily. I drink redbush/rooibos tea which is naturally caffeine free.
I just worry how it's going to be in years to come, I'm only 51 😟

[CLKD]

Ah, that is probably way too much regardless of how much perspiration is released!

The first pee of the morning should be dark and may smell.  During the day the pee should be straw coloured, any lighter and there is too much fluid going through the body!  Food as well as liquid diverts to the kidneys. 

[Ljp]

CLKD Not sure I agree that one to one and a half litres is too much to drink during a workout, and it does depend on weather and how hot I'm feeling.

A friend of mine who drinks at least 2 litres of water a day, was recently told by her osteopath that she's not drinking enough.

I dont drink excessive amounts, in fact there are days when I know I haven't drunk as much as I should do.

[Janice68]

Hi Ljp,
I can totally relate to your post!!
I also only have a cup of coffee as a treat too and drink up to one and a half of litres of bottled water a day and herbal teas one or two a day.
My doc has checked for infections and nothing there.
She thinks it's my pelvic floor issues causing it. Everything feels so different down there as my pelvic wall muscles are weakening and a mild prolapse in womb is going on. But anyway as DG said also I'm up 3 or 4 times a night weeing and frequency through the day too like you.
Im not on full hrt only vagifem every other night at first I thought it was vagifem causing it but I don't think so at all.
I'm seeing doc about it next week again.
I now use Hydromol down below to help with the irritation below. It's so annoying I know!!!
Take care janx

[babyjane]

I drink 6 x 200ml glasses of water a day in addition to decaffeinated or camomile teas, if I don't my mouth gets very dry.  My morning pee is certainly not dark and smelly, that sounds awful, although it is darker than daytime pee.

[Ljp]

Do you also get the dull ache in your bladder at times?

I don't feel I have pelvic floor weakness, I have a pelvic floor toner and am able to hold the smallest one with all the weights on, for over half an hour while getting ready in the mornings.
I don't use it daily, but rarely is it a problem to retain.

I question whether the pelvic floor  and bladder can become almost too tense dye to the urgency and frequency and having to hold myself

[Janice68]

I do get a dull ache down there and also feel a burning sensation too. Ive been told it's not my VA causing it I'm on vagifem for that.
Also with the bladder thing I don't leak either. I am seeing a pelvic floor specialist physio.
I'm glad you don't feel pelvic floor weakness. It's so strange I don't understand it but I just muddle through. At the moment I don't work so that takes that pressure of me. I can't imagine an employer letting me having wee breaks every 5 mins god the anxiety if it all.

[saffy123]

Hi Ljp,
I can really relate to this. Bladder issues were my first peri symptom (which apparently is fairly unusual). I do get a dull achy feeling (but never sure if its more in the vagina area?). For me stress/worry/anxiety really heightens the problem - the constant frequency just adds to the worry  I have no leaking etc and I can hold but it gets very painful.

I have been using Estring for the last 5 weeks and upped estrogel to 3 pumps.
Previously I have had the urethra stretched, as apparently it was very narrow (normally only seen in post menopausal women).
I do think holding wee (even though there is not much there) has had a big impact on my pelvic floor - I think the whole area is tight, I am seeing a pelvic floor therapist, but this has been of little help so far.
Any way sorry I can't offer any solutions, just know I truly understand how you feel. Lets hope we find something one day that
helps xx

Also I avoid all caffeine even chocolate 

[Taz2]

Hi Ljp - this sounds like Overactive Bladder Syndrome. https://www.nbt.nhs.uk/sites/default/files/attachments/Overactive%20bladder%20syndrome%20(OAB)_NBT002734.pdf  I would ask for  a referral to a bladder/continence specialist as the longer you leave it the worse it may get. You need to retrain your bladder which can take time but is worth persevering with.

Taz x

[CLKD]

What would an osteopath know about how much is correct for your friend? The only way to tell is for the GP/Practice to arrange an input/output chart! 

A lot of 'advice' about how much a person should drink daily is pushed by the Bottled Water Companies.  One doesn't see your local water Company advocating such information.  We take in fluids from other sources, i.e. food which is diverted to the kidneys as necessary.

A person can drink too much which can B fatal as it depletes the body of essential minerals. 

One should drink when 1 is thirsty or if one is exercising enough to cause regular sweating.  Seeking advice from a trained sports professional may be the way to go i.e. from a cycling or running club.  I read at the weekend that some of the 'sports' drinks aren't worth buying, that plain old water will do ;-).

[babyjane]

this is from the NHS Choices website, nothing to do with bottled water companies

'The Government produced Eatwell Guide says we should drink six to eight glasses of fluid a day. Water, lower fat milk and sugar-free drinks including tea and coffee all count.'

I was once advised by a nutritionist that if you wait until you actually feel thirsty that you are already partly dehydrated.  That's what thirst is.

[CLKD]

How large is a glass though?