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[Demelza21]

Hi

This is a duplicate post as I'm not sure where I posted it originally - new member and easily confused - partly as a result of this dratted menopause.

I'm new to the forum and want to see if anyone has any suggestions.  I'm 54  and for the last 18 months my sleep pattern has been worsening.  I can get to sleep very easily but I wake after about 2 hours maximum.  Some nights it's even less.  A good night is when I sleep for about 3 hours without waking.  I always need to urinate then - well I always do just to avoid the lying there wondering if I really do need to - but get back to sleep easily.

So I can get to sleep, I can get back to sleep I just can't stay asleep.

I've tried the pillow sprays, wrist sprays, herbal teas, even full blown sleeping tablets from my GP with no impact.  On my last visit to my GP he suggested anti depressants!

I've seen a gynaecologist (privately as the GPs solution was the anti depressants) and have started on Evorel patches which for a couple of weeks did seem to be helping but a stressful time with an aged parent disrupted it again and even with going up to the higher dose it doesn't seem to be helping.

I'm not getting hot sweats in the day (I was last year but they seemed to fade off towards the end of the year, occasionally at night but I am incredibly anxious and insecure plus very jittery - almost like a permanent minor panic attack.  I was prescribed oestrogen tablets but they seem to make the anxiety and jitters worse so I'm not taking them at the moment.

I know that everything improves with a good nights sleep so any suggestions regarding that or anything I can do would be appreciated.

You hear all about the hot sweats as a symptom but it's everything else that's driving me round the bend!

Thanks

[CLKD]

  ………..

Lack of sleep is a problem many complain about here!  I did find years ago, when in a busy job, if I woke up in the night I wouldn't get back to sleep.  One night I decided that I hadn't died yet from not sleeping and after that sleep was easier, probably not worrying about it helped. 

For several years I had a radio by the bed and soothing music on throughout …… that helped too.  Sprays kept me awake 

Extra oestrogen can cause the jitters Bcause the body doesn't require it.  Exercise can ease jitters as can eating regularly, because a sudden dip of blood sugar can cause an anxiety surge  .  This can happen as a flush is beginning to occur.

Trial and Error can be tiring at a time we want to feel well    Browse round, ask away!

[Mary G]

Demelza21, welcome to MM!

My first thoughts are, what dose of patch are you on?  I wonder if your patch dose is too low and that is why you are still suffering with these symptoms.

Sleep deprivation is one of the worst aspects of the menopause and my mother has not had a full night's sleep for over 30 years.  Your sleep pattern sounds exactly like hers, she gets off to sleep OK but then wakes up after a couple of hours or so, goes to the loo and then can't get back to sleep.  She has had as little as two hours sleep some nights and it has gone on for years. 

I am also 54 and about 9 years post menopause.  I have been on HRT for most of that time apart from when I have come off it to have base line blood tests and also I got fed up with it a few years ago and took a year out.  I didn't have sleep problems during my time off but I don't know if I would have had I stayed off HRT long term. 

When my oestrogen levels were too low, I did get night time panic attacks in very hot weather, particularly in Spain.  I didn't feel hot and my body was cool to touch but I felt as though I couldn't breathe and someone was suffocating me.  The air conditioning would be roaring away in the bedroom and I used to lay in bed at night thinking we were all going to die from the heat!  I felt trapped and it was no use going outside because it was even hotter out there.  Once I upped my dose, this went away completely.

You say your doctor offered ADs but this should not be the first line of defence in your situation.  I think the first thing you need to do is find out if you are on the right dose of oestrogen and go on from there.  I use Oestrogel which I have found to be more effective than the patches. 

[Hurdity]

Hi Demelza21

 

Sorry to hear you are tired - but I am somewhat puzzled as you say you can get back to sleep easily so this should help you get a reasonable night's sleep in total, even if you wake a few times? My problem is always that when I wake in the night (to wee or if my husband does so) then I can't always get back to sleep straight away and often anyway awaken around 4 am and only go into light sleep, but always wake very tired.

I think to sleep through without waking at all would be very unusual from peri-menopause onwards, and 3 hours for your first deep sleep is actually quite good as long as you are getting 6-8 hours in total (depending on your body). We do need less sleep as we age and of course the menopause disrupts this as you are finding, and especially in the period when night sweats are beginning to develop. I know I started to wake in the middle of the night feeling hot all the time -  before the sweats themselves actually started at night - and that is enough to wake you up!

What were your periods doing before you went on HRT eg for the previous 12 months or so? Also you mention different doses of Evorel patches and oestrogen tablets so I presume you either have a Mirena coil or have had a hysterectomy?

If your oestrgoen levels have declined and you are eg late peri-menopause then a 50 mcg patch may well be sufficient to eliminate flushes and sweats and help restore your sleep pattern, but of course depends on what your own levels are/were.

As Mary G says - once you get on the right dose you should feel more comfortable - but if you are still very much in peri-menopause when hormones are still fluctuating - then anxiety and jittery feelings seem to be part of that sadly.

Hurdity x

[Ukg1kcw]

Hi I am a new member, just turned 50 in December and also have been waking up every night between 3-4 am since last August , some days I feel exhausted , also have been bleeding every 2 weeks since last March , my test came back showing not in peri menopause but think I'm heading into it . Completely sympathise as I need a good nights sleep to operate for work so has been a huge struggle , feel as if there is nobody to help sometimes