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[pepperminty]

Hi GypsyRoseLee,

It's definitely a Mine Field. It's just knowing how to dodge the mines!!
Thank goodness you eventually fell asleep with the meds. But as you say that it is then difficult to tell what is working.
 We are both on the second month I believe so there is still a chance that it can even itself out and improve. I have taken your advice and emailed my GP to ask to be referred to the meno clinic. And I have asked for another prescription for Femeston 1/10. They probably think I am mad as I said last week I was going to stop taking them !!
 I haven't a clue what symptoms are going to crop up day by day. I can manage all of them , except for sleep deprivation and mood swings ( the severe ones that is ). I hope that by month 3 all our side effects are ironed out!! Or that if needs be, the combined one is better for us as its more constant. I probably wont get an appointment for 3 months though as the waiting list is so long.
Hopefully you will feel better in a few days and your holiday excitement will kick in. Maybe getting away from it all will be the tonic you need?
I am trying to remind myself that it is not abnormal for it to take a while before you find the right HRT and dosage . I am actually a very positive person normally , but it's hard when you are controlled by your hormones , in such a dramatic way and feeling so crap!
Lets hope that we both see an improvement on the progesterone part this month again .
Keep strong and remember that you have had some good days .

pepperminty xx

[GypsyRoseLee]

Thanks pepperminty, your post made me laugh.

It is like a minefield and you're expected to navigate it wearing a bloody blindfold.

I started my HRT mid cycle, so have only been on it 3 weeks today and have just finished my withdrawl bleed. So am technically on my first 'proper' full cycle, but really it feels like my second. We'll have to hold each other's hands as we walk through this minefield again and see if we don't make a better job of it second time around 

Have spoken to a few people who said that it definitely took 'months' rather than 'weeks' for the HRT to fully settle in. Maybe the posts I've read on here saying it only took a week or two are the exception rather than the rule? Also I think lots of women mainly take HRT for the hot flashes and aches and pains, and maybe it does get to work on those physical symptoms much quicker?

But I've never had a hot flash or any aches or pains yet. With me it's all about the awful mood swings laced with anxiety and crappy sleep. I'm really hoping that it just takes longer for the HRT to get to work on these psychological symptoms. Like you I would very much prefer to be dealing with the hot flashes and aches and pains rather than this awful anxiety/low mood.

I've had quite a bad headache every day since my bleed started last Saturday. But it doesn't bother me in the slightest. Yet the mood swings and anxiety really scare me and just drag me down. I HATE feeling so overwhelmed by them and so helpless to control them.

I am glad you have requested an appointment at a meno clinic. I got my first appointment through in 3 weeks, so you might be lucky. Then again, I had to wait 5 months for my next one though. And if it turns out that we're one of the few oddballs who actually prefer progesterone, then so be it and we'll take combined HRT. I have started another thread asking if anyone else prefers the prog' phase of their sequi HRT and if they swapped to combi as a result. That should make for interesting reading.

To be frank, right now I would drink hot rat's piss if it would stop these low moods and anxiety and insomnia 

[CLKD]

Why does the body do that jumping thing: I step up or off a pavement  .  Such a  jolt sometimes

Stop worrying about not being able to sleep.  Easier said than done but it worked for me.  My routine is a hot bubble bath with cuppa and Very Good Book, into bed and read or do crosswords.  Once I begin to feel drowsy I lay down and if the Racing Brain stays quiet I sleep.  Otherwise  ……….

Then I read ……….

[pepperminty]

Thanks GypsyRoseLee,

I have just stopped laughing (almost)after reading your post .
I have  got back from Pets Are Us with a rat, as I'm so desperate like yourself !! Anything's worth a go!!
I am exactly the same , its the exhaustion and inability to cope. We are probably a bit too optimistic in terms of how long it may take  , we could eventually be lucky?
 My periods were a bit hit and miss , so I started my first pack when they should have started , but didn't.
I am completely knackered today, although have managed to do the housework!!
We sound very similar in terms of HRT problems I agree.
Can't wait to see the thread on progesterone!! Lets hope there are some good news stories regarding it!!
I am 3 days off the progesterone bit , I do hope that I feel ok on them , I don't mind being the oddball if I feel ok !!

Pepperminty xx

[GypsyRoseLee]

That's good advice CLKD. I am trying to be more pragmatic about the sleep issue. If I don't sleep it's not the end of the world and life doesn't grind to a halt. I need to stop getting so panicky about it, I know.

[GypsyRoseLee]

Sounds like I'm about 7 days behind you on my cycle. Bizarrely I am looking forward to taking the Utro, considering how terrified I was of taking it for the first time a few weeks ago 

I think we need to give it at least 3 months before deciding whether it has 'worked' or not. I know one lady on here, Galadriel I think, said it took about 10 weeks for her moods/anxiety to disappear. She very nearly didn't bother buying her third pack of HRT but is so glad she stuck with it.

Last year when I started taking Amitriptyline (before I suspected my anxiety and low mood were hormonal) it took about 11-12 weeks for it to fully take effect. Every day for those 11 weeks I was constantly assessing how I felt and did I feel better worse. Mood was all over the place. Anxiety rising and falling. Sleep was better almost from day one though, I must say.

Then finally I realised it had been 'a while' since I had felt anxious/low.

I expect it will be the same with HRT, especially as we're taking it to control mood/anxiety too.

[pepperminty]

Hi I agree , I am also taking it for fatigue , which I get whether I have slept or not unfortunately. I did have more energy last year when I took prempac , which is a stronger dose of oestrogen , but I did react badly on that progesterone, so I stopped it. Perhaps that will take time to go as well.  But funny thing is I feel more tired than I did on the first months pack and that was the same before. I don't know what this means if anything?  Lets give it the 3 months at least.
It does help to get it off ones chest and I think it is human nature to question things and try to find solutions and patterns/answers . I think one has to go through this and eventually you come out the other side .
 You can't bypass unfortunately. If you could I'd gladly take the bypass . But for now I am on the M1 desperately clinging onto the steering wheel , hoping that the brakes don't fail!!
Pepperminty xx

[GypsyRoseLee]

I think it would be more helpful if we were told categorically by GPs not to expect any improvement for at least 10-12 weeks. Even if secretly the GPs knew that the effects could kick in way before that.

That way you wouldn't be constantly assessing yourself in the first few weeks and constantly feeling disappointed and worried. I am sure it is totally counter productive and you just tie yourself in knots.

It's strange that you're again feeling more tired on this second pack, unless it's just your body adjusting? As in you have to go down a bit before going up and up? I know this can happen with ADs in that you often feel worse for the first few weeks while they take over your brain chemistry.

Curiously, I am feeling quite a bit brighter and more positive since about 4.15 pm today? That's how rapidly my mood can change in that I can pin point it almost to the minute. Bizarre.

I wonder if my low mood/anxiety were caused by the come down off the Utro? And then further damage was done by my withdrawl bleed, as for the last year I have noticed that my mood/anxiety worsened as my period started and continued until about 2 days after period finished. This would tie in with this month on HRT, as my bleed finished on Tuesday and now 2 days later I can feel my mood rising?

But then THAT would mean that I am now responding well to my own natural rise in oestrogen + the oestrogen in my patch. So does THAT mean I could perhaps do with a higher dosage of oestrogen patch (currently only on Estradot 25mg) so I am not so badly affected by the come down off the Utro + the real dip in mood during my bleed???

Aaaarrrrggghhhhhhhhh??

Answers! I need so many answers to so many questions. I wish I had married a gynaecologist 

[pepperminty]

Ha, you are assuming that the Gp's know what they are talking about when it comes to HRT. Mine told me last year it wasn't possible to have side effects on the progesterone !! I was floored at that and felt like I was a freak.
 I agree that they seem to dish it out without any real guidance , which is so important. We all seem to be flying in the dark.
I also wondered do I need more oestrogen??
There doesn't seem to be any consistent management and advice with HRT by health professionals for those who need it unless you are so far down the line you are desperate and then have to wait for weeks if not longer.
I think the nurse specialist in menopause /HRT,that I spoke to is married to the chief gyny' at the hospital. She sounded happy, maybe that's the answer!!???
Keep me posted !!

peppermintyxx

[GypsyRoseLee]

Hmmm, something else I have just thought of too. For the last 10 days I have been wearing my patch on my bum. But at lunchtime I put my new one on my stomach. I wonder if that has any bearing on my mood rising from about 4-ish?

It must be so handy being married to a gynaecologist. Like being married to a chef or hairdresser 

[pepperminty]

It's strange how maybe something like that can make a difference . Maybe it's getting there faster on the stomach??. 

Just don't ask the gynaecologist to cook dinner or the hair dresser to- it could get very confusing !!

[CLKD]

I was the same when first taking ADs.  Would it work, would I feel worse  , my GP told me that one AD had no known side-effects: well, it did have and after 3 days I didn't dare take any more.  It was new to the Market.  Now many people particularly State side are suing the manufacturers!

When hungry I don't always recognise symptoms so worry that if I eat I'll feel worse    ….. 

If I wake in the night it's to see if I feel sick.  Or because I've had busy dreams.  Or ……. then my brain gets going  if I feel OK then I lay quietly, listening to the noises around the house or DH's breathing.  Eventually I drop off again. 

[GypsyRoseLee]

CLKD the very first sertraline tablet I took caused me to have insomnia that night for the very first time, ever. After the 2nd tablet I had my first ever panic attack.

I stuck it out for 25 more days but my anxiety was much, much worse. I woke my hubby in the night to tell him I wanted to die. If I had stayed on it any longer I dread to think what I might have done.

Went back to my GP who admitted that sometimes sertraline can dramatically increase anxiety in some people. I went on Patient UK and found posts from hundreds of people who had suffered in a similar way within hours of taking sertraline.

[GypsyRoseLee]

Not sure pepperminty? Plenty of people wear it on their bum and say it's fine. It just seems a coincidence? But I am 2 days post bleed and my mood would always start to rise at this time before I started HRT.