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[Dandelion]

Hi I went to my doctor today and told her that I wanted to stay on Femoston 2/10 as I have only been on it for seven weeks.
I also told her that I was getting along ok with the dydrogesterone, bu the hrt itself wasn't working properly as I am still getting hot and sweaty but only in the upper part of my body.
I enquired about a tad more oestrogen if the Femoston is still not working after a month more on it.

My doctor said that I am on the highest dose and was not prepared to give me more oestrogen due to the risks, even though I said I was prepared to run those risks.

She said that if the Femoston still does not work properly after a month, then, if I don't want the other hrt option, the one with norethisterone in it, then I would just have to go through menopause.
She said that when they take me off hrt, I would have to go through menopause anyway.

I felt a bit greedy because I am still not satisfied on the max dose of oestrogen, so, maybe it is just me, because Femoston 2/10 should be working for me. It works for many other women, and I am not even fully menopausal yet, so, maybe it is just me.

It's the overheating I can't stand. The sweat makes my hair greasy but I dont like washing my hair too often as it's dyed and I get split ends. (I do use a special oil on it, but I would rather not be showering all the time and washing hair/clothes because I never had to was my hair/body/clothes this often when I was not peri-menopausal.

My mum had a complete hysterectomy and she made do with starflower oil, so I do feel a bit greedy talking about 2mg oestrogen being insufficient.

I told her about the ladies on here, and that some of them get gel or patches and use micronised progesterone but she had never heard of it before.
She asked if I was talking about American women and I said no, English ones.
I told her I get jealous of the women for whom HRT gives them back their lives.

She told me she would consult her colleagues, to see if anyone of them know what I am on about because she was well baffled.

My doctor is a good one, and is actually menopausal herself but she said she has to put up with the flushes and nightsweats as she is not allowed to take HRT.

I thought the risks were small with HRT but my doctor said they increase the more you take it. I say b0ll0c*s to the risks, I would rather have HRT and quality of life and risk cancer/heart attacks etc, than live for decades miserable without HRT.

[CLKD]

You could ask your GP to send Dr Currie a PM 

Your body won't be the same now as before peri-menopause, that's why this time of Life is called 'the change'.  You may need to wash your hair daily, if you stand under the shower or use tepid water without shampoo, that will freshen it, some people use vinegar as a rinse but I don't want to smell like a chippy    ........... I use baby products, what's good enough for baby  .......... you may find that you feel better if you subcome to regular hair washing/bathing ............

[Hurdity]

Sadly Dandelion your doctor is ignorant and shame on her especially as she is menopausal herself. OK Fair enough they are GPs and can't be expected to know everything, but you would think that if someone comes along with knowledge gained from a respected organisation on the web she would go and find out.

I can't remember how long you've been on 2/10 but give it a while longer - sometimes it can take a few eeks to really deal with the flushes and sweats. If it really doesn't do the trick and you have been tested for other things eg thyroid etc, then you may be able to get a higher dose from gel or patches which don't have to be digested nor go through the liver. You might need to print off the information from this menu and direct her to this website! At least she is asking other colleagues - and perhaps you might want to consult someone else in the practice after making enquiries as to who is most knowledgeable about HRT ( maybe the practice nurse will know who this is?).

As you are peri (I think I remember?) then you should still have some oestrogen of your own but some women like yourself do start to get sweats very early on in the journey of oestrogen decline!

Hurdity x

PS Just seen your post CLKD - the facility for consulting Dr Currie is on the front page and costs £25

[CLKD]

Hand the info to the GP?

[Dandelion]

Hi CKLD and Hurdity

I've only been on the Femoston 7 weeks so I know that I haven't given it a long enough time to work.

It did start working after two weeks on it but it seems to have stopped working.

I started taking magnesium daily and that has helped loads with the flushes. I only get one on waking and maybe one more on some days.

To be honest, I don't think my GP will want to discuss it further once she has spoken to a colleague, because I have gone on about hormones for the last few consultations.

I'm sure my doctor sees loads of peri menopausal women as she has been a GP ages and is one of the more popular doctors in our surgery.
I got the impression that the Femoston should be working as it is 2mgs oestradiol and I am only peri and not post or meno itself.

There is a patch on offer, but the oestrogen part of the patch is norethisterone and I am too scared to try it in case it makes my anxiety worse.
My anxiety is not as bad as it was, say, a few years ago, when I was in acute tranquiliser withdrawal, but when it was bad I didn't cope at all.
I got irrational and believed things that were not true.

I don't want to be taking anything that may make my mental state worse, like I have heard norethisterone do. I'm frightened of how I will be on it.

I have ordered glycine due to it's calming effect on the nerves, so, if this, together with the magnesium works I may stick with the Femoston.

I just want to ask, if Femoston is insufficient oestrogen for me, does that mean that I will still be at more risk of osteoporosis, or do you only need a little bit of oestrogen for bones.

Thank you

[CLKD]

Osteoporosis is different issue. Have you looked at the UK-based osteoporosis web-site?  Brisk walking can help avoid the onset of bone thinning. 

I know where you are with medication, once my mental health was stable I was very scared of taking anything that might upset the apple cart and make me feel worse, even eating was problematic for years  …….. little steps 

[Hurdity]

You will be getting plenty enough oestrogen to protect your bones - it's just that women develop flushes at different points as I said in my previous post below. I didn't start getting them until a few months after stopping periods. There is info on osteoporosis on this site here:
http://www.menopausematters.co.uk/osteoporosis.php

Also as I think we have mentioned before - the combi patches are not the only way to get HRT transdermally - as I said below you can use oestrogen only gel or patches, and then use a separate progesterone. The bio-identical ( ie most natural to the human body) one is micronised progesterone (Utrogestan) which is normally taken orally (but some of us use it vaginally). Unless you are unlucky enough to be very progesterone intolerant then this should not make you depressed although it does have some side effects ( as does the progesterone in our natural menstrual cycle). It does have a calming sedative effect. I'm sure we have outlined this before and all the info is in the left menu under HRT preparations.

Let's hope you soon feel better on the Femoston!

Please try not to worry so much Dandelion!

Hurdity x

[Dandelion]

You will be getting plenty enough oestrogen to protect your bones - it's just that women develop flushes at different points as I said in my previous post below. I didn't start getting them until a few months after stopping periods. There is info on osteoporosis on this site here:
http://www.menopausematters.co.uk/osteoporosis.php

Also as I think we have mentioned before - the combi patches are not the only way to get HRT transdermally - as I said below you can use oestrogen only gel or patches, and then use a separate progesterone. The bio-identical ( ie most natural to the human body) one is micronised progesterone (Utrogestan) which is normally taken orally (but some of us use it vaginally). Unless you are unlucky enough to be very progesterone intolerant then this should not make you depressed although it does have some side effects ( as does the progesterone in our natural menstrual cycle). It does have a calming sedative effect. I'm sure we have outlined this before and all the info is in the left menu under HRT preparations.

Let's hope you soon feel better on the Femoston!

Please try not to worry so much Dandelion!

Hurdity x

hi Hurdity and CKLD

Thanks for the info on onsteoporosis. That scares me the most, I will look at the site. UNfortunately brisk walking is what brings on sweats. Some of my tops have been spoilt cos of sweating, the underarms all scuffed.
I do shower regularly.

I know about the oestrogen only patches and the micronised progesterone, but I am having real problems trying to get my doctor to prescribe me these.
She has not heard of micronised progesterone and she has not heard of bio identical progesterone either, so I have hit a brick wall there.
Ideally, I would like the oestrogen only patches or gel and micronised progesterone, but I am finding it mission impossible to get these out of my doctor.

[Sarah2]

If you can, you need to try to get rid of the mind-set you are in - that is being a 'nuisance' to your dr!

Why are these people drs if they are so uncaring???

You are not being a nuisance- your dr is plainly ignorant and being a bully  by refusing to give you drugs that are perfectly acceptable, easily available, and in many ways safer ( transdermal is safer than tablets as far as blood clots are concerned) simply because 'she has not heard of them'.

well, frankly, that is her problem and she ought to be ashamed of it.

I was prescribed gel straight away by my gynae- his choice-  because he said it had many advantages including safety and being able to alter the dose easily.

According to the chairman of NICE patients are entitled to ask for and be given drugs they have a right to, and he wants them to work in partnership with their drs. She is behaving unethically I'd say.

You  might like to read this link from NICE
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-25890572

You might remind her of this!

I know how you feel about Norethisterone but I've been on it for almost 5 years- have recently changed- and didn't have too many side effects at all, taking it for a few days only each cycle. I had no 'preconceptions' of it or its dark side, because I didn't know anyone else on it.  It's possible that having negative thoughts about something can be a self-fulfilling prophecy. But I agree that if you want to try Utrogestan then she ought to allow this.

You might find you get on well with what you are on now- they say give all HRT 3 months and see how you go.

As for her opinion that when you come off it and you will go through meno that's not accurate either- the evidence is that it's 50-50, so you might be one of the lucky ones who doesn't have a return of symptoms.

But don't be bullied!

[Dandelion]

If you can, you need to try to get rid of the mind-set you are in - that is being a 'nuisance' to your dr!

Why are these people drs if they are so uncaring???

You are not being a nuisance- your dr is plainly ignorant and being a bully  by refusing to give you drugs that are perfectly acceptable, easily available, and in many ways safer ( transdermal is safer than tablets as far as blood clots are concerned) simply because 'she has not heard of them'.

well, frankly, that is her problem and she ought to be ashamed of it.

I was prescribed gel straight away by my gynae- his choice-  because he said it had many advantages including safety and being able to alter the dose easily.

According to the chairman of NICE patients are entitled to ask for and be given drugs they have a right to, and he wants them to work in partnership with their drs. She is behaving unethically I'd say.

You  might like to read this link from NICE
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-25890572

You might remind her of this!

I know how you feel about Norethisterone but I've been on it for almost 5 years- have recently changed- and didn't have too many side effects at all, taking it for a few days only each cycle. I had no 'preconceptions' of it or its dark side, because I didn't know anyone else on it.  It's possible that having negative thoughts about something can be a self-fulfilling prophecy. But I agree that if you want to try Utrogestan then she ought to allow this.

You might find you get on well with what you are on now- they say give all HRT 3 months and see how you go.

As for her opinion that when you come off it and you will go through meno that's not accurate either- the evidence is that it's 50-50, so you might be one of the lucky ones who doesn't have a return of symptoms.

But don't be bullied!

Hi Sarah

Yes, you are right, I shouldn't feel a nuiscance, but my doctor did get a bit of a strop on about it, and I felt too intimidated to argue with her.

I'm no good with bullys.

Thanks for telling me the gel is safer.

Thanks for the NICE link, I will read.

Fingers crossed that my Femoston 2/10 starts working again, because it did. Also, I see no reason why it shouldn't as it works for almost everyone on here who has upped their dose to 2/10 and I am, afterall, not even fully menopausal yet.

[CLKD]

Could you take someone with you to the next appt., if we feel vulnerable it's easier not to push or have the energy to ask for what we require. 

[Dancinggirl]

Dandelion - I just want to add a comment.  In one of your posts on this thread you said your flushes have been much better -"I started taking magnesium daily and that has helped loads with the flushes. I only get one on waking and maybe one more on some days" - this is a great improvement, so my impression is that your have most of your meno symptoms under control.  Femiston seems to be suiting you because you are not being affected by the progesterone part - I wouldn't try anything else just yet - give it more time.  When you move to a different HRT it takes time for the body to adjust and if you try something that mucks up your mental state that would be counterproductive.
You describe getting hot and sweaty when you do some brisk walking - I get hot and sweaty when walking briskly even on HRT - I think this is very normal and not a meno symptom.  In fact, I would say that if you are doing appropriate exercise (like walking briskly) getting a bit hot and sweaty would be a good thing!! I never used to sweat much when I was younger but I have found that I do sweat much more these days - I'm just not as fit!!!!
By the way, I came off full HRT four months ago and my meno symptoms haven't been nearly so bad this time.  I am 58 now but I took a break from HRT when I was 49 and suffered 3years of flushes, night sweats etc before giving in and going back on HRT fro another 4 and half years.  So the idea that when you come off HRT you will just have to go through all the dreadful symptoms anyway is not necessarily true - we are all different and for me it has been a matter of coming off at the right time.
Keep posting - we are here to help.  DGx

[CLKD]

I don't sweat as much  …………. HORMONES 

[Dandelion]

Hi CKLD and Dancingirl

I think I will stay on the Femoston longer.
I did notice a reduction in flushes once I got on the magnesium.
I heard about trying magnesium on these boards.
I still sweat on the upper body only, especially the neck.
I think it may be because I am only 7 weeks on the 2/10

As for my doctor, she got all funny when I mentioned HRT, almost like I was trying to get her to prescribe abusable drugs or something. It was like she saw it as a sore subject. She was great when discussing my other meds.
I'm wondering if she is being funny with me because she is also having flushes/sweats but says she has to just put up with them as she is not allowed to take HRT as she has issues that mean that HRT is contra-indicated for her.

[Sarah2]

I found this for you and thought it might help with your being unable to stand up to bullies! You could be right about HRT being a touchy subject for your dr- but really, is that a professional way for her to behave? Allowing her own personal circumstances affect how she treats ( in every sense) her patients?  Her own circumstances should have no bearing at all on what she does for her patients.



Being assertive means being direct about what you need, want, feel or believe in a way that's respectful of the views of others. It's a communication skill that can reduce conflict, build your self-confidence and improve relationships in the workplace.

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Make the decision to positively assert yourself. Commit to being assertive rather than passive or aggressive and start practising today.

Aim for open and honest communication. Remember to respect other people when you are sharing your feelings, wants, needs, beliefs or opinions.

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Agree to disagree. Remember that having a different point of view doesn't mean you are right and the other person is wrong.

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Stay calm. Breathe normally, look the person in the eye, keep your face relaxed and speak in a normal voice.

Take a problem-solving approach to conflict. Try to see the other person as your friend not your enemy.

Practise assertiveness. Talk in an assertive way in front of a mirror or with a friend. Pay attention to your body language as well as to the words you say.

Use ‘I'. Stick with statements that include ‘I' in them such as ‘I think' or ‘I feel'. Don't use aggressive language such as ‘you always' or ‘you never'.

Be patient. Being assertive is a skill that needs practice. Remember that you will sometimes do better at it than at other times, but you can always learn from your mistakes.