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[Clovie]

Hello again, sorry to keep popping questions on here - but you all are really knowledgeable and helpful so thank you for that 

I am going back to see my meno specialist tomorrow and want to be armed with as much info as I can..

I wonder if anyone can shed any light or experience on this please -

I am quite badly and clearly progesterone intolerant.
I need to take progesterone as I have a womb and I'm only 49.

Now, I am going to insist on trying Utrogestan tomorrow when I see my doctor , am going to refuse Mirena (though she is keen for me to go down that route)

But to avoid having unopposed oestrogen if I find I am still symptomatic with the utrogestan I am willing to try antidepressants for the progesterone phase of my HRT.

It was once suggested to me years back while suffering with PMS that I might try SSRIs on second half of my cycle ONLY (progesterone phase of cycle ) Apparently its quite common for doctors to prescribe these just for the second half.
I declined to try these at the time as I had had no success while on a number of different SSRIs for PND previously. But I am now WORSE regarding progesterone elements of the HRT I have tried so far, (and also reacted very badly to the prog in COCP.)

My question is mainly - IF antidepressants are supposed to take 6 weeks or so to 'kick in' how on earth can they have any effect when taking them for a mere 2 week period on and off?
I do not understand.

I would be willing to try these on a part-time basis. I do NOT like antidepressants as they don't seem to work on me (well they never did years ago) plus they have awful side effects but mainly they affect my... ahem... bedroom activities - and that is not at all going to help!

Thanks for reading, glad of any insight as always xxxx

[Liz]

Hi - I'm afraid I can't answer your specific question about the ADs, but I can relate to the problem with the progesterone in the second half of the cycle.  I started on Sequi patches almost a month ago and found I felt really good during the first two weeks on the Oestrogen-only phase, but once I got into the second phase (Oest + Progesterone) I've not been feeling quite as good.  I think this is a common problem for those on Sequential HRT.

What symptoms do you have during your Progesterone phase?  Obviously depression from your question, but anything else?

[Clovie]

hi Liz

I'm so sorry you're not feeling good either, I can surely empathise.
About symptoms - well, I've had a total and utter nightmare with the progesterones I've tried on my short career with HRT (so far ONE cycle of Cycloprogynova, ONE long cycle of Tridestra, 15 days of COCP Microgynon - each time each medication abandoned when on the prog phase as I am like a Jekyll and Hyde character and cannot go on  ) 

with symptoms including (are you ready?  )....

Tearful for no specific reason
irritable bordering on anger
bickering with my poor hubby for no reason
no interest in usual things I like
low tolerance for kids bickering
paranoia (no-one likes me, no-one wants to be my friend - this made worse by us living in countryside in a new area kids are older now so don't meet mums at school gate)
depression - waking in small hours - consumed by feelings of despair and utter bleakness 
feeling my life is pointless, feel old, undesirable etc
NO libido - AT ALL
blowing things out of all proportion.
more as well but can't recall right now - I NEVER want to feel like that again

so, mainly psychological symptoms as you can see. And only when on prog.
It's soooooo clear that its the progesterone that is causing this 


need to point out - normally I'm happy upbeat, enjoy a good giggle, night out, see live music etc you get the picture. 


What are your symptoms Liz? xxx

[Liz]

I had similar symptoms to you, although I have to say I think yours sound worse than mine.

My weirdest symptom was developing an intolerance to other people's noise........ if I heard my neighbour's music it would send me into a panic/rage....... got to the point where I was frightened to come home  in case I could hear it.

How stupid is that??? Seems to have settled down now, thankfully.

[Taz2]

It sounds like really bad PMT to me - it can rule so much of your life. I had it for the last ten days of every cycle and then when I began to get further into meno it was the only good thing - the PMT disappeared and for the first time since I was 14 I was free of the horrible mood swings, depression and I didn't throw any plates or slam any doors    Then I started HRT and for the last ten days or so of the cycle the PMT symptoms came back. For the first time I was really sure that hormones were to blame and that I hadn't just been making an excuse for all those years.

Taz x 

[Liz]

The unfortunate thing is there doesn't seem to be any alternative to taking Progesterone for us peri ladies, so if it causes problems it's a real pain.

[Hurdity]

for the first time since I was 14 I was free of the horrible mood swings, depression and I didn't throw any plates or slam any doors   

This made me laugh! Sorry I know it's a serious subject but reminded me of when I once hurled an apple at my husband ( years ago) in such a state - and I was such a bad shot that it went straight through the window pane, shattering it! Never done it since.... He still reminds me (and other people!) of it sometimes when I get a bit cross which is rare these days.

Hurdity x

[Taz2]

I remember slamming the front door so hard that the glass broke. Fast forward to my husband coming home from work and finding the boarded up panel. He called our three young sons downstairs and sternly asked them who had broken the glass. I can still see their little faces as they solemnly, as one, turned and silently pointed their fingers at me!!

Taz x 

[Suz]

Hi Clovie,

I am so sorry you are going through such a tough time with HRT Progesterone phase.

I started HRT in Dec 12 and for about 3 months was exactly as you describe: cry,paranoid, insane, no libido,poor kids and hubby, poor people at work, road rage, you name it, etc. I then decided to experiment a little with some oestrogen gel I had from my previous gel+utrogestan prescription (utrogestan didn't agree with me).

My meno specialist agreed that its ok for me to top up with oestrogen and after doing that for about a month it all settled. BUT I am on conti HRT with norethisterone as a progesterone. My moods are ok now, I don't want to kill anyone and generally seem to be settling.
I occasionally have. 'Interesting' days and on those I top up with oestrogen.

SSRI, you can take 5htp for the cycle progesterone cycle, as it does the same, if not better than ADs.
Also, AD are all different types depending on what you need them to do and Drs can advise if that's appropriate course of action and which one would b more suitable. 
Generally progesterone eats up serotonin so u need extra serotonin in that phase.

Yes, AD normally do take 6 weeks to settle, but don't forget each person reacts diff as well. Some feel the 'lift' almost same day. AD can b like HRT you need to find the one tat works for you and the correct dosage.

Goodluck for tomorrow Clovie,

Suz x